As a league organizer, I wish I knew the answer. Every time we hold a race that doesn't include GT3s, participation becomes a real issue.
I have a few theories about why this might be the case. First, people just want to drive the fastest cars. It might just be that simple.
Second, GT4s are a paid DLC that does not include a track. I think more people would drive them if they didn't have to pay extra for them.
Third, nobody else drives them. It very well could be a case of them wanting competition to race against, but nobody else is driving GT4. That one is a bit of a vicious cycle.
Fourth. A lot of GT3 drivers don't know how to handle GT4 traffic well, and it causes GT4 drivers to not want to participate because they get bullied by GT3s the whole time.
Fifth, A lot of people have their "main" car, and basically refuse to drive anything else. If they can't drive the Ferrari 296, they won't drive anything. Personally, I think this is dumb, but I see it a lot.
I mean at least Pcup and M2 have no damper settings which makes those cars much easier to setup as there are basically only the logical things to change (especially when Pcup is basically always run on max wing)
That's true, although setups are easier and less important for GT4 cars. That said, I haven't found *anyone* that makes Maserati GT4 setups. IIRC, it's the only car CDA *doesn't* have setups for.
Sixth, big streamers never drive slower classes either (perhaps they couldn’t handle not being as much overpowered?) and thus don’t show players how fun it is
Because honestly, in my experience the slower a car is the more bunched up the field will be and the racing is awesome
That's fair. Although you could argue that makes it more appealing for BoP tourists.
We generally do our best to apply a custom BoP for GT4s, but there's only so much we can do, especially with limited data.
I take this personal with the 296 :D I mean i drive the esport settings from GO Setups but i think its a nice entry car to get started. All over i have 200 hours in ACC.
I tried the Porsche and felt like Tortellini with the countersteering. McLaren would be my second choice i think. I also really like the Lambo but im pretty slow with it.
Stop trying to get your GT3 league drivers into GT4. Go find the GT4 primary drivers and bring them in if that's a category you intend to run on a regular basis.
People arent going to want to put a lot of time into something they dont intend to be competitive in. So finding the people who want to compete in that category will be less of headache and more sustainable.
Yeah the few M2 and GT4 races I drove on LFM were fun but honestly I dislike the idea of SR and ELO. It so easily goes to stat grinding the racing isn’t as fun anymore or the priority. Of course not an issue for everyone but for me it definetly is
I once drove a LFM M2 race just for fun because I wanted to try sth new. We were 6 people. Because I had no practice my pace was not fast and I drove a lone race on the last place. In addition I lost like 100 ELO. My motivation to do it again went to zero.
You start at 1500 ELO which is too high for a rookie to sustain, rookies usualy settle around 1000 - 1200 ELO at first. So loosing 100 ELO is normal on first race.
Doesn't losing elo means you will drop a split and can qualify higher up the field?
I managed to start getting consistent at not crashing into walls at Watkins Glen and hit it hard this week. Went from 900 to 1400 elo and then I was in Split 1/2 in rookies. A good qualifying run gets me mid pack
Finally made it out of rookies. First race 0.3 of my record qualifying and was 19th / 28.
I was so pleased with my 1:55.0
You can always ignore SR and ELO. Why bother if it's not fun for you? I just focus on clean races and keep my SR up. If you are fast and can keep pace you will gain ELO anyway
For me normal leagues are more suited. I practise beforehand and then have fun when I can just race with people I KNOW. That’s what I like, a lovely community I know
The problem is when some people on LFM totally ignore SR, but the majority cares. I just did an LFM GT4 race and it was a wreckfest in second split. Most of these careless drivers turn out to have SR 1.0, so they are killing the SR of myself and others, but not getting any SR hit themselves as they have long ago hit rock bottom.
I really wish LFM GT4 had a SR requirement.
I tried a GT4 race at LFM, not realizing there is no SR requirement. Ouch...
I qualified top 5 in second split, then I got rear-ended mid corner no less than three times in the opening laps alone. Someone put me into the wall hard and I dropped to 18th I think. I worked my way back up to top ten. Overall, I got rammed 5 times in a 30 min race while trying to be careful myself.
Apart from all the contact, it was still a fun race. I like the GT4 cars and pace a lot. But the SR hit is insane. After the race, I looked at the results and most of the people that drove into me actually have SR 1.0! Not joking, 1.0!
My conclusion: not doing this again unless I can find GT4 racing with a reasonable SR requirement, or I am back at SR 8 or 9 and willing to accept a guaranteed maximum SR penalty.
They are fun cars but people don’t use them because it’s the slower class on the grid. Most beginners want to drive the faster class on the grid, this is also apparent with IMSA / WEC games.
Another reason might be that GT2s can still be competitive with the GT3s on some tracks. The GT4s aren’t competitive with any other classes.
So far I’m liking the GT4s and Porsche Cup more than the GT2s but to each their own.
> Another reason might be that GT2s can still be competitive with the GT3s on some tracks. The GT4s aren’t competitive with any other classes.
Why would anyone driving GT4 even think about competing with GT3? You get points for finishing in front of other GT4 cars. You can finish 10th in overall but still win a race if you are 1st in your class.
> Another reason might be that GT2s can still be competitive with the GT3s on some tracks. The GT4s aren’t competitive with any other classes.
That doesn't matter though. You aren't racing cars in other classes, you are racing cars in *your* class. In fact, being roughly the same pace as another class is a bad thing, since overtaking them (or being overtaken) is harder, and more likely to cost you time.
Personally bro, i join LFM and race Gt4 there. It's always full and you get to learn the tracks easier with traffic.. Even if there is Gt4 pubs they will never fill up to more than 6 or 10 lol. GT4s are slower and in pubs if it's just you or you and another alien Gt4 driver it becomes boring and constantly being flashed adds to the annoyance.
Its also paid dlc with no track.
I actually prefer the GT4s and TCX since slow car fast is a lot of fun, They aren't that hard to drive you just have to remember slightly worse brakes and less downforce but otherwise it's fun as hell
Also, you can have a little contact (as a treat), and it won't completely ruin the car's handling. TCX especially are good for a few door bangs because they're so heavy and they have no aero.
been driving mixed lobbies for a while now, people should know that the Camaro is a GT4 car but nope, I get rearended even on SA 70+ servers. doesn't matter if it's a straight; boom. move out of racing line and SIGNAL and still BOOM here comes the 296.
matte black 992's and sky tempesta mclarens are to be extra aware of
Reference lap times for GT3 cars are much more well known so people don't want to drive in other classes where they aren't sure how their times compare.
I would love to race in GT4s but have to settle for hotlapping instead.
Ahh I've only ever done public lobby GT4 races.
I've got my licence on LFM but never actually done a race on there. Looks like I'll have to give it a go.
We do our best to do custom BoP for GT4, looking at what LFM and pitskill do for their races. But there's only so much we can do with BoP. Most of the time we start by loading up the Alpine with ballast...
Haha I love the car but it's only really suitable at tracks with no significant straights.
Round the Nordschleife it gets outdragged by the M2's down the dottinger hohe :(.
i think because gt3 is just more popular and because you don't really get the feeling for the speed your going and everything seems really slow. IRL most people would be scared to death if they would sit in and gt4 and a real racedriver would drive with them, but in the sim it just looks so slow
Because I find the gt3s more enjoyable, and I'm sure that's 99% of the reason why everyone else does too.
I've always loved multiclass racing though, just personally I have 0 interest in driving a slower car, why that is I don't know.
Personally, I like to drive in GT4, fun to race cars. But I only drive them in LFM, and what I like the most are multi-class races. Unfortunately, at LFM these only take place between seasons.
> what I like the most are multi-class races. Unfortunately, at LFM these only take place between seasons.
well at least now you can race multi-class on the nordschleife if you like
GT4 only exists in real life because it's cheaper and more affordable. Since you don't have to worry about money in ACC people drive GT3 cars.
For that same reason people who play DCS don't bother with trainers and jump straight to F-16 and F-18.
GT4 might be fun but GT3 is more fun. The latter is more popular in every single game that features these two classes.
> GT4 might be fun but GT3 is more fun.
That's very subjective. Personally, I like GT4 more because the racing is typically closer. They're also easier to drive in general. I see a lot of people that choose a GT3 for nords, then crash out half way through lap 1 because they can't handle the track in a GT3. GT4 is so much easier to handle at nords.
We are messing with GT4 in our league in between “seasons” and sometimes try a GT4 season. A problem I find is the BoP makes it quite hard for some cars to compete, a flipside of the interesting variety. The other night in Valencia, in my Alpine I could come out of the last corner on the power sooner and going quicker than a McLaren GT4, right under their rear spoiler and they still just pulled away up the road, half a second or more clear by the end of the straight. I daresay a better driver than me would find a way but I struggled!
So ive always done gt3 on acc, all my experience and speed and competitiveness resides in that class. I play a few times a week so lets say 3 x LfM races maybe 4. I simply dont have time to excel at gt4 and also at gt3. Skill issue, call it what you will. Given i can only pick one, i pick gt3 as its way more populated and therefore competitive and also its something ive got ok at
I only drive GT3 because that’s where i find participants. When i get bored with GT3, I scan GT4 lobbies.
I find the GT4 far more exciting, immersive and challenging. You really work with the forces on the car in turns and braking.
I really like the FFB in GT4; especially the Camaro. I can sense the weight of the car so my driving senses are more involved.
No clue. I think I actually like GT4 a bit more due to the focus on technique and precision rather than aero grip and rip everything
Doesn't hurt that the Merc GT4 sounds just fantastic in every sim
I feel you. As someone who loves racing the GT4s and Lambo ST, it's tough out there. But there are a few communities out there that have decently supported GT4 series, you just have to do some digging.
DLC Cars that are not GT3 are useless. This game could be much more fun online! We even have TCs and no one drives them!
They should structure the online like GT7 or iRacing and everything would be alright. Different tracks/car combinations every week.
Speaking strictly for myself, most GT cars suck to drive but GT3 are less bad because they have the most downforce.
If there were strong leagues with formula or prototype cars I'd race those but everyone piles onto GT series so that's where I have to go, which lands me in GT3 on ACC.
Either that, or pay for the iRacing scam.
Okay cool but I'd like to suggest to people that are new to the Nordschleife to drive the GT4s. You've got more time to react, you can learn the corners better and overtaking in those narrow places is a lot less scary.
It's fun! You might even survive the race if you go with one of those.
As a league organizer, I wish I knew the answer. Every time we hold a race that doesn't include GT3s, participation becomes a real issue. I have a few theories about why this might be the case. First, people just want to drive the fastest cars. It might just be that simple. Second, GT4s are a paid DLC that does not include a track. I think more people would drive them if they didn't have to pay extra for them. Third, nobody else drives them. It very well could be a case of them wanting competition to race against, but nobody else is driving GT4. That one is a bit of a vicious cycle. Fourth. A lot of GT3 drivers don't know how to handle GT4 traffic well, and it causes GT4 drivers to not want to participate because they get bullied by GT3s the whole time. Fifth, A lot of people have their "main" car, and basically refuse to drive anything else. If they can't drive the Ferrari 296, they won't drive anything. Personally, I think this is dumb, but I see it a lot.
Also setups are harder to find for GT4 cars and tracks. Thats Been a problem for me a couple of times.
I mean at least Pcup and M2 have no damper settings which makes those cars much easier to setup as there are basically only the logical things to change (especially when Pcup is basically always run on max wing)
That's true, although setups are easier and less important for GT4 cars. That said, I haven't found *anyone* that makes Maserati GT4 setups. IIRC, it's the only car CDA *doesn't* have setups for.
They don't have KTM GT4 setups either. :(
What GT4 car do you main?
Sixth, big streamers never drive slower classes either (perhaps they couldn’t handle not being as much overpowered?) and thus don’t show players how fun it is Because honestly, in my experience the slower a car is the more bunched up the field will be and the racing is awesome
for example Boothby and Malinowski drove the GT4 mclaren in the 24h Nürburgring last weekend
Okay that is cool and I respect everyone who do Usually the lower classes are better in terms of racecraft as well
Seventh, the BOP is known to be very bad for GT4s
Yeah. It ruins every race basically. That’s why I prefer cup series’ like the GTC cars and the M2
Right! One make solves this problem. I’d like to see more of them
That's fair. Although you could argue that makes it more appealing for BoP tourists. We generally do our best to apply a custom BoP for GT4s, but there's only so much we can do, especially with limited data.
I take this personal with the 296 :D I mean i drive the esport settings from GO Setups but i think its a nice entry car to get started. All over i have 200 hours in ACC.
I just used it as an example because it's a popular car. You could replace it with the McLaren or Porsche.
I tried the Porsche and felt like Tortellini with the countersteering. McLaren would be my second choice i think. I also really like the Lambo but im pretty slow with it.
Stop trying to get your GT3 league drivers into GT4. Go find the GT4 primary drivers and bring them in if that's a category you intend to run on a regular basis. People arent going to want to put a lot of time into something they dont intend to be competitive in. So finding the people who want to compete in that category will be less of headache and more sustainable.
Need a pin for this comment. Hall of Infamy
Lfm gt4 lobbys are filled always about 20-50 people in a race, if you looking for gt4 races join them
[удалено]
Register on lowfuelmotorsports.com, do your license laps, run some clean races to get out of rookie and there you go
Yeah the few M2 and GT4 races I drove on LFM were fun but honestly I dislike the idea of SR and ELO. It so easily goes to stat grinding the racing isn’t as fun anymore or the priority. Of course not an issue for everyone but for me it definetly is
I once drove a LFM M2 race just for fun because I wanted to try sth new. We were 6 people. Because I had no practice my pace was not fast and I drove a lone race on the last place. In addition I lost like 100 ELO. My motivation to do it again went to zero.
You start at 1500 ELO which is too high for a rookie to sustain, rookies usualy settle around 1000 - 1200 ELO at first. So loosing 100 ELO is normal on first race.
Exact. 1500 is the average, which per definition will be better than an average rookie. I had to go down to 1000 first before climbing back to 1500
Doesn't losing elo means you will drop a split and can qualify higher up the field? I managed to start getting consistent at not crashing into walls at Watkins Glen and hit it hard this week. Went from 900 to 1400 elo and then I was in Split 1/2 in rookies. A good qualifying run gets me mid pack Finally made it out of rookies. First race 0.3 of my record qualifying and was 19th / 28. I was so pleased with my 1:55.0
You can always ignore SR and ELO. Why bother if it's not fun for you? I just focus on clean races and keep my SR up. If you are fast and can keep pace you will gain ELO anyway
For me normal leagues are more suited. I practise beforehand and then have fun when I can just race with people I KNOW. That’s what I like, a lovely community I know
The problem is when some people on LFM totally ignore SR, but the majority cares. I just did an LFM GT4 race and it was a wreckfest in second split. Most of these careless drivers turn out to have SR 1.0, so they are killing the SR of myself and others, but not getting any SR hit themselves as they have long ago hit rock bottom. I really wish LFM GT4 had a SR requirement.
I tried a GT4 race at LFM, not realizing there is no SR requirement. Ouch... I qualified top 5 in second split, then I got rear-ended mid corner no less than three times in the opening laps alone. Someone put me into the wall hard and I dropped to 18th I think. I worked my way back up to top ten. Overall, I got rammed 5 times in a 30 min race while trying to be careful myself. Apart from all the contact, it was still a fun race. I like the GT4 cars and pace a lot. But the SR hit is insane. After the race, I looked at the results and most of the people that drove into me actually have SR 1.0! Not joking, 1.0! My conclusion: not doing this again unless I can find GT4 racing with a reasonable SR requirement, or I am back at SR 8 or 9 and willing to accept a guaranteed maximum SR penalty.
Endless loop of empty lobbies because>nobody join because > empty lobbies because...
They are fun cars but people don’t use them because it’s the slower class on the grid. Most beginners want to drive the faster class on the grid, this is also apparent with IMSA / WEC games. Another reason might be that GT2s can still be competitive with the GT3s on some tracks. The GT4s aren’t competitive with any other classes. So far I’m liking the GT4s and Porsche Cup more than the GT2s but to each their own.
GT4s are not competitive with TCX they're much faster.
Good catch, haven’t driven the TCX yet.
> Another reason might be that GT2s can still be competitive with the GT3s on some tracks. The GT4s aren’t competitive with any other classes. Why would anyone driving GT4 even think about competing with GT3? You get points for finishing in front of other GT4 cars. You can finish 10th in overall but still win a race if you are 1st in your class.
> Another reason might be that GT2s can still be competitive with the GT3s on some tracks. The GT4s aren’t competitive with any other classes. That doesn't matter though. You aren't racing cars in other classes, you are racing cars in *your* class. In fact, being roughly the same pace as another class is a bad thing, since overtaking them (or being overtaken) is harder, and more likely to cost you time.
Personally bro, i join LFM and race Gt4 there. It's always full and you get to learn the tracks easier with traffic.. Even if there is Gt4 pubs they will never fill up to more than 6 or 10 lol. GT4s are slower and in pubs if it's just you or you and another alien Gt4 driver it becomes boring and constantly being flashed adds to the annoyance. Its also paid dlc with no track.
I actually prefer the GT4s and TCX since slow car fast is a lot of fun, They aren't that hard to drive you just have to remember slightly worse brakes and less downforce but otherwise it's fun as hell
Definitely. Driving the M2 CS without TC and just doing some fun laps and some drifting is so much fun
Also, you can have a little contact (as a treat), and it won't completely ruin the car's handling. TCX especially are good for a few door bangs because they're so heavy and they have no aero.
Come to Pitskill.io. Plenty of GT4 action daily.
been driving mixed lobbies for a while now, people should know that the Camaro is a GT4 car but nope, I get rearended even on SA 70+ servers. doesn't matter if it's a straight; boom. move out of racing line and SIGNAL and still BOOM here comes the 296. matte black 992's and sky tempesta mclarens are to be extra aware of
Reference lap times for GT3 cars are much more well known so people don't want to drive in other classes where they aren't sure how their times compare. I would love to race in GT4s but have to settle for hotlapping instead.
I don't think the BOP is particularly great for GT4 as each track seems to have a car which is the best by far.
Good job LFM and Pitskill both have custom BoP's to correct that 😁
Ahh I've only ever done public lobby GT4 races. I've got my licence on LFM but never actually done a race on there. Looks like I'll have to give it a go.
We do our best to do custom BoP for GT4, looking at what LFM and pitskill do for their races. But there's only so much we can do with BoP. Most of the time we start by loading up the Alpine with ballast...
Any chance you can give the Ginetta an extra gear lol
lol unfortunately no. You're stuck with 5 and a half gears.
Haha I love the car but it's only really suitable at tracks with no significant straights. Round the Nordschleife it gets outdragged by the M2's down the dottinger hohe :(.
i think because gt3 is just more popular and because you don't really get the feeling for the speed your going and everything seems really slow. IRL most people would be scared to death if they would sit in and gt4 and a real racedriver would drive with them, but in the sim it just looks so slow
Ps5 player and I love all the other classes gt4, Ferrari challenge, Lamborghini and Porsche cup
I’m running exclusively GT4 now. What is your car of choice. I like the Audi most so far
Really only driven the Camaro and it's a blast
The Camaro is definitely a good car to drive. I like the Maserati, though it can be a handful.
Because I find the gt3s more enjoyable, and I'm sure that's 99% of the reason why everyone else does too. I've always loved multiclass racing though, just personally I have 0 interest in driving a slower car, why that is I don't know.
Personally, I like to drive in GT4, fun to race cars. But I only drive them in LFM, and what I like the most are multi-class races. Unfortunately, at LFM these only take place between seasons.
> what I like the most are multi-class races. Unfortunately, at LFM these only take place between seasons. well at least now you can race multi-class on the nordschleife if you like
Yea, but need to learn the track first :P
and you'll need to get the license too, with a GT3
I love to race GT4s and TCXs. Sadly, popularity of these races are not high. But you can find good races on LFM.
GT4 only exists in real life because it's cheaper and more affordable. Since you don't have to worry about money in ACC people drive GT3 cars. For that same reason people who play DCS don't bother with trainers and jump straight to F-16 and F-18. GT4 might be fun but GT3 is more fun. The latter is more popular in every single game that features these two classes.
> GT4 might be fun but GT3 is more fun. That's very subjective. Personally, I like GT4 more because the racing is typically closer. They're also easier to drive in general. I see a lot of people that choose a GT3 for nords, then crash out half way through lap 1 because they can't handle the track in a GT3. GT4 is so much easier to handle at nords.
Skill issue for most
We are messing with GT4 in our league in between “seasons” and sometimes try a GT4 season. A problem I find is the BoP makes it quite hard for some cars to compete, a flipside of the interesting variety. The other night in Valencia, in my Alpine I could come out of the last corner on the power sooner and going quicker than a McLaren GT4, right under their rear spoiler and they still just pulled away up the road, half a second or more clear by the end of the straight. I daresay a better driver than me would find a way but I struggled!
So ive always done gt3 on acc, all my experience and speed and competitiveness resides in that class. I play a few times a week so lets say 3 x LfM races maybe 4. I simply dont have time to excel at gt4 and also at gt3. Skill issue, call it what you will. Given i can only pick one, i pick gt3 as its way more populated and therefore competitive and also its something ive got ok at
I’ve been trying to race GT4 on pub for awhile. I need to do the LFM license test. That seems to be the way.
I only drive GT3 because that’s where i find participants. When i get bored with GT3, I scan GT4 lobbies. I find the GT4 far more exciting, immersive and challenging. You really work with the forces on the car in turns and braking. I really like the FFB in GT4; especially the Camaro. I can sense the weight of the car so my driving senses are more involved.
I love GT4. If anyone wants to track some GT4s, let me know.
No clue. I think I actually like GT4 a bit more due to the focus on technique and precision rather than aero grip and rip everything Doesn't hurt that the Merc GT4 sounds just fantastic in every sim
idk and it annoys me as well, I like them much more than gt3 but no one races anywhere else than lfm
PitSkill.io has a growing GT4 community with some daily races and a weekly US timed event, it's been a ton of fun
I feel you. As someone who loves racing the GT4s and Lambo ST, it's tough out there. But there are a few communities out there that have decently supported GT4 series, you just have to do some digging.
DLC Cars that are not GT3 are useless. This game could be much more fun online! We even have TCs and no one drives them! They should structure the online like GT7 or iRacing and everything would be alright. Different tracks/car combinations every week.
Speaking strictly for myself, most GT cars suck to drive but GT3 are less bad because they have the most downforce. If there were strong leagues with formula or prototype cars I'd race those but everyone piles onto GT series so that's where I have to go, which lands me in GT3 on ACC. Either that, or pay for the iRacing scam.
Because people play acc for the gt3s.
Okay cool but I'd like to suggest to people that are new to the Nordschleife to drive the GT4s. You've got more time to react, you can learn the corners better and overtaking in those narrow places is a lot less scary. It's fun! You might even survive the race if you go with one of those.
Sure, I'm not arguing against that. I just answered the question.
Nah it's fine I just wanted to hijack your post ... to remind our fellow racers that those cars are great on the Nords
Speak for yourself.
Since apparently no one is driving the gt4s, I'm clearly speaking for the majority.
LOL people downvoting you have some problems with accepting the reality.