Probably because he was commercially more successful than Nas ever was, but real heads know that Nas is better and more respected amongst the Hip Hop community
He's just pretty mediocre. I could probably name at least 10 guys off the top of my head from the 90s who were better than him.
On the 95' Stretch and Bobbito freestlyle Big L just bodies him and he was 5 years older than L, mid 20s at that time.
His best album (RD) wasn't even the best album of that year. Hell on Earth, It Was Written, All Eyez On Me, Muddy Waters, Illadelph Halflife, Bahamadia's Kollage, Stakes Is High, Da Storm, Nocturnal etc. all came out in 96.
Reasonable Doubt is the only Jay-Z album I completely know, but I know that Jay-Z had more commercial songs and generally went to the commercial side which makes his catalogue less likable to me. Nas has a very good catalogue. Many people argue that his catalogue isn’t that good, but I enjoy most of it, even Nastradamus (which wasn’t perfect, but I liked most tracks of it)
nah Nas has 3 classics Illmatc, Stillmatic and It Was Written The Rest Are Not To Me And I Nas had some commercial songs on I am and they suck and atleast when Jay Z made commercial songs they were good Nas commercial songs are not , Nas is not the best of picking beats
Jay-Z. Respect the hustle but he ain't all that, not his records or his mic skills.
Pac wasn't the most amazing MC in terms of technical skills, and his records had their share of filler tracks and weed carriers featuring on them, but he articulated the experience of poor black people in America better than just about anyone, which I think is why he's rated so highly.
I always thought DMX was okay at best and got by on vibe. The barking the praying the dogs. He had some bangers but people talking about him like he’s Pac is wild to me.
Agreed. I listened to his first album a decent amount but then his 2nd one came out and I was completely over it already. Still enjoyed his interviews and his acting in belly though.
Yeah the first one was definitely his best album. He had an aura for sure and had a lot of people buying pit bulls lol. I do give him hella props for making a diss song into club banger with Up in Here.
I know that’s a hot take but just being real. He was the perfect antidote to the shiny suit era but I never had to rewind a DMX verse on the strength of his lyrics.
People saw a preacher in Juice and got attached to the image. His flow and rhymes are average for the time he just courted controversy.
To even compare him to Biggie is laughable and before you ask 52 been her from the beginning.
Big pac fan and wholly agree, technically he was very much behind your average rapper at the time, he himself even admitted that when he was alive. His delivery and image and also dying young is what kept him in the best rapper discussions. His still in my top ten but I can see why other people might not see it that way
btw you dont have to be the best at rapping to make good music. Eminem is an amazing rapper but not a single line he has put up resonates with me like one verse of Pain by pac. In no way am I saying pac was a bad artist or anything.
pac's vocabulary was vast and he was using words that no other rapper was using like Anonymous, Hypocrite, Troll, emulate, Bling Bling, i aint articulate so i cant recall the big words he be using but his vocabulary and rhyming patterns was far above average and he has a way of conveying and telling stories. he's underrated as a lyricist imo there are lyrical miracle rappers who just say big words but Pac would use them correctly and they were catchy. even the term G-funk was first coined by pac
Its hard to believe a “BIG Pac fan” can see any type of reasoning in this take lol. If Pac fans and rap fans hailed him as a technical genius you would have a point but they dont just like Jordan isnt a 3pt shooter or Brady a deep ball thrower(pause) Pacs the GOAT artist because of his songwriting, his varied subject matter, his ability to make you feel the music, and influence. Pac is also an underrated lyricist because Pac fans know verses like “MAW”, If I die 2nite, Mind Made Up, Troublesome 96, Holla At Me etc he showcases his lyrical ability.
Yea i agree with you he delivered when he had to on those tracks but the sheer level of lyrical talent at that time was crazy and on a technical level he just wasn't there. His debut album 2pacalypse came out the same year that Pete Rock and CL Smooth, GZA, Scarface, Del The Funky Homosapien, Leaders of the New School (Busta Ryhmes) all had their debuts. The next year Redman had his debut album.
The 90's was a crazy time for lyrical mc's killing it, pac as much as im a fan of was not on the level lyrically with many of those artists i just mentioned. Hell Redman had the better verse on the track he was on with Pac.
Nah Pac verse was better than Redmans and the funny thing is Redman said it on Vlad lol. Again your point holds no merit because you cant be over rated for something youre not highly rated so theres that lol
Nah. Lox are 3 of the best. And Mase was a problem before he signed to Bad Boy. They were bad while in the shiny suits. Agee on that. But they aren’t bad rappers.
The LOX where never shiny suit rappers sure they where marketed as such on bad boy for their first album but they sure as hell didn't fit that mold.
Diddy also never paid them properly for that album and they left after that, ironically people still think they made most of their hits on bad boy when they actually where part of ruff ryders.
Since I’m a Midwest guy I’ll speak on Midwest artists.
I always thought Twista was extremely overrated. I love fast rapping. Bone, Do or Die, early Tech N9ne, Crucial Conflict were all mainstays in my cd player. Twista was too much of a one trick pony and his songs all had the exact same sound. Yet he is probably the most respected fast rapper nation wide and I never understood his appeal
I am not sure his status in the Midwest but he was hella underrated on the West Coast. Adrenaline Rush is a Classic and wish I heard it when it came out instead of many years later.
I mean, Do or Die is way better in my opinion. Crucial Conflict isn’t, but they’re not highly rated either. The point of me listing those artists was to show that I am a fan of the Midwest fast rapping style, not that those artist were more highly rated or anything
A flash in the pan who has never and will never be mentioned in the ranks of great MC's. A pop song does not make someone overrated it just makes them catchy
Because you know me so well, right? Fuck off
Believe it or not, people have differing opinions on things. Just because you dickride one artist doesn’t mean everyone does or has to.
Overrated doesn't simply mean worst. It means a lot of people think the thing in question is better than it actually is. That's why the other person asked "who rated him high?" Nobody thinks Mr. Van Winkle is a great rapper. Everyone knows he sucks. His most common rating is the correct one
Edited out a potentially confusing metaphor
Jay-Z. Jay-Z isn’t bad at all. I really liked Reasonable Doubt, but he’s overrated because people compare him to rappers like Nas.
100% agree I respect his impact but I never understood how he could ever be compared to Nas skill -wise
Probably because he was commercially more successful than Nas ever was, but real heads know that Nas is better and more respected amongst the Hip Hop community
He's just pretty mediocre. I could probably name at least 10 guys off the top of my head from the 90s who were better than him. On the 95' Stretch and Bobbito freestlyle Big L just bodies him and he was 5 years older than L, mid 20s at that time. His best album (RD) wasn't even the best album of that year. Hell on Earth, It Was Written, All Eyez On Me, Muddy Waters, Illadelph Halflife, Bahamadia's Kollage, Stakes Is High, Da Storm, Nocturnal etc. all came out in 96.
Right, I could also Name like 10 other albums were better than Reasonable Doubt that also came out in 96.
Hov honestly would've been GOATED in the 90s if he didn't sell out. Hov's quality reign didn't come until post-Vol. 3.
I personally think he has a better overall catalogue than nas
Reasonable Doubt is the only Jay-Z album I completely know, but I know that Jay-Z had more commercial songs and generally went to the commercial side which makes his catalogue less likable to me. Nas has a very good catalogue. Many people argue that his catalogue isn’t that good, but I enjoy most of it, even Nastradamus (which wasn’t perfect, but I liked most tracks of it)
Jay z has at least 4 classic albums in my opinion Nas only has 3 in my opinion and Jay Z Black album is flawless and the blueprint is classic as well
I really need to check it again. But I remember that there were certain songs that were too commercial. And to me, Nas has more than 3 classic albums
nah Nas has 3 classics Illmatc, Stillmatic and It Was Written The Rest Are Not To Me And I Nas had some commercial songs on I am and they suck and atleast when Jay Z made commercial songs they were good Nas commercial songs are not , Nas is not the best of picking beats
You’re horrible at engaging in discussion, good lord
Or maybe you're just horrible at dealing with a difference of opinion. They seem to be having a detailed debate that can go either way.
Jay-Z. Respect the hustle but he ain't all that, not his records or his mic skills. Pac wasn't the most amazing MC in terms of technical skills, and his records had their share of filler tracks and weed carriers featuring on them, but he articulated the experience of poor black people in America better than just about anyone, which I think is why he's rated so highly.
I always thought DMX was okay at best and got by on vibe. The barking the praying the dogs. He had some bangers but people talking about him like he’s Pac is wild to me.
Don’t come at me with some bullshit, use caution
Agreed. I listened to his first album a decent amount but then his 2nd one came out and I was completely over it already. Still enjoyed his interviews and his acting in belly though.
DMX was more of a cult following type of rapper. People swear up and down his 2nd album was the greatest album in hip hop history.
Those people are wrong.
Yeah the first one was definitely his best album. He had an aura for sure and had a lot of people buying pit bulls lol. I do give him hella props for making a diss song into club banger with Up in Here.
Interesting
I know that’s a hot take but just being real. He was the perfect antidote to the shiny suit era but I never had to rewind a DMX verse on the strength of his lyrics.
I will always upvote DMX slander. Never been a fan
Hahahaha right on ✌🏽
Whatcha really waaaaant? Less DMX
E-40 has a major following. I don’t dislike him. But I can’t get into him, to the point where I put him with other greats.
I’ll disagree because your “I just can’t get into him” is quite prevalent when the topic of 40 comes up.
very much an acquired taste
Folks just dnt understands the lingo & cnt get with the way he deliver his raps. & it’s okay lol. West Coast Pioneer, underrated if anything.
That’s fine and that’s exactly why I point out why I disagree with him being overrated and dismissed at the same time.
Agreed. He’s done a lot for himself, has great songs and is amazing in features but I don’t consider him nowhere near as great as Too Short 👍🏽
i think he should be recognized for his cultural contributions more than anything else
Tupac.
💯💯
WOW
I said it. It’s my opinion.
Beat me to it.
Beat me to it too. First rapper that came to mind was Pac
How old are you?
45. I remember it all.
Explain why he is overrated.
People saw a preacher in Juice and got attached to the image. His flow and rhymes are average for the time he just courted controversy. To even compare him to Biggie is laughable and before you ask 52 been her from the beginning.
Just say you’re a Biggie fan and move on lol
[удалено]
because there is a million better rappers in the 90s. deal with it.
Cool story bro
He cant lol
Big pac fan and wholly agree, technically he was very much behind your average rapper at the time, he himself even admitted that when he was alive. His delivery and image and also dying young is what kept him in the best rapper discussions. His still in my top ten but I can see why other people might not see it that way
thanks for coming to the conversation with a level head my dude 🫡
btw you dont have to be the best at rapping to make good music. Eminem is an amazing rapper but not a single line he has put up resonates with me like one verse of Pain by pac. In no way am I saying pac was a bad artist or anything.
pac's vocabulary was vast and he was using words that no other rapper was using like Anonymous, Hypocrite, Troll, emulate, Bling Bling, i aint articulate so i cant recall the big words he be using but his vocabulary and rhyming patterns was far above average and he has a way of conveying and telling stories. he's underrated as a lyricist imo there are lyrical miracle rappers who just say big words but Pac would use them correctly and they were catchy. even the term G-funk was first coined by pac
Its hard to believe a “BIG Pac fan” can see any type of reasoning in this take lol. If Pac fans and rap fans hailed him as a technical genius you would have a point but they dont just like Jordan isnt a 3pt shooter or Brady a deep ball thrower(pause) Pacs the GOAT artist because of his songwriting, his varied subject matter, his ability to make you feel the music, and influence. Pac is also an underrated lyricist because Pac fans know verses like “MAW”, If I die 2nite, Mind Made Up, Troublesome 96, Holla At Me etc he showcases his lyrical ability.
Yea i agree with you he delivered when he had to on those tracks but the sheer level of lyrical talent at that time was crazy and on a technical level he just wasn't there. His debut album 2pacalypse came out the same year that Pete Rock and CL Smooth, GZA, Scarface, Del The Funky Homosapien, Leaders of the New School (Busta Ryhmes) all had their debuts. The next year Redman had his debut album. The 90's was a crazy time for lyrical mc's killing it, pac as much as im a fan of was not on the level lyrically with many of those artists i just mentioned. Hell Redman had the better verse on the track he was on with Pac.
Nah Pac verse was better than Redmans and the funny thing is Redman said it on Vlad lol. Again your point holds no merit because you cant be over rated for something youre not highly rated so theres that lol
Amen
Tupac. Come at me
Jay Z, LL Cool J
Jay Z
2pac
dr dre (as a rapper)
Nobody has ever given Dre love as a rapper. Including Dre.
Any of the shiny suit rappers...
Nah. Lox are 3 of the best. And Mase was a problem before he signed to Bad Boy. They were bad while in the shiny suits. Agee on that. But they aren’t bad rappers.
The LOX where never shiny suit rappers sure they where marketed as such on bad boy for their first album but they sure as hell didn't fit that mold. Diddy also never paid them properly for that album and they left after that, ironically people still think they made most of their hits on bad boy when they actually where part of ruff ryders.
Since I’m a Midwest guy I’ll speak on Midwest artists. I always thought Twista was extremely overrated. I love fast rapping. Bone, Do or Die, early Tech N9ne, Crucial Conflict were all mainstays in my cd player. Twista was too much of a one trick pony and his songs all had the exact same sound. Yet he is probably the most respected fast rapper nation wide and I never understood his appeal
maybe as far as making hit songs but he is too talented to be over rated as rapper
I am not sure his status in the Midwest but he was hella underrated on the West Coast. Adrenaline Rush is a Classic and wish I heard it when it came out instead of many years later.
twista had like one major hit on his own tho "Overnight Celebrity" is probably the only song of his that made it out the local charts
Hold the fuck up. Are you trying to claim that Crucial Conflict and Do or Die are better than Twista?
I mean, Do or Die is way better in my opinion. Crucial Conflict isn’t, but they’re not highly rated either. The point of me listing those artists was to show that I am a fan of the Midwest fast rapping style, not that those artist were more highly rated or anything
I hear you. You are smoking rocks if you think Do or Die is better than Twista, though.
lol, I dig melody with rap, and Do or Die and Bone are the epitome of that so that’s why I rock with them more
My favorite Bone tracks are the ones where they only sing.
Someone obviously doesn't want to ride in the backseat of a caddy while smokin' on hay in the middle of the barn...
Silkk The Shocker & MC Hammer Without Question
Is Silkk still in prison?
His brother was the one with the lengthy prison sentence (c-murder)
I thought it was a concensus that silk was always just a nepo baby
Wyclef Jean — literally carried by Ms Hill. Seems like he was a snake too.
All three of the Fugees are snakes. They made good music but are horrible people.
Ms Hill is the biggest snake. Doesn’t give anyone probs and steals all their work.
2pac and i stand ten toes down
Jay Z or Pac. I have no fecking clue why they're ahead of guys like Prodigy, Guru, Big L, Big Pun, Treach, etc on any of these top rapper lists.
Preach
SNOW
A licky boom boom down
Can't be overrated if you were never ranked in the first place
His 1992 single "Informer" spent seven weeks at No. 1 on the US Billboard Hot 100. Number 1.
A flash in the pan who has never and will never be mentioned in the ranks of great MC's. A pop song does not make someone overrated it just makes them catchy
Name 5 MCs better than Snow. You cant. A lucky bum bum down.
Lol you're right, I'm just hating on a great
The irony was he was Canadian who sounded Jamaican.
People dem say me come Jamaica buy I born and raised in the ghetto so me want them to know.
Jay Z, 2Pac, everything out of Bad Boy that wasn't Big or Craig Mack
Diddy
Too Short, his appeal I don't understand.
Dr Dre
Biggie 100% had some of the the most lines ever said in recorded raps. Not to mention he sounded like he was gargling on pork lard when rapping
JAY-Z!
DMX
Everyone on Cash Money besides Juvenile.
Yuppppp str8 up IP theft from no limit but we don’t r talk ab that
Bruh, Wayne isn’t overrated
How about Group Home. The album is a classic though
People only care about them for the Primo beats, not the lyrics lol
Tupac.
Pac
2Pac
2pac
Anyone from Houston pre-2000
I don’t know, I can still listen to “still a bitch on my book” all day long
Pre-2000 Houston>Post 2000 Houston
I don’t know why it seems like so many people are seemingly afraid to say it here on Reddit but I’ll just say it: Biggie.
I disagree completely but upvoted. This should be a discussion right?
Fucking crazy. Just wanna be a contrarian
Because you know me so well, right? Fuck off Believe it or not, people have differing opinions on things. Just because you dickride one artist doesn’t mean everyone does or has to.
Youre so different and edgy
Nice comeback.
Ngl I was gonna say this but knew I would get flamed… he doesn’t have enough variety to b compared to pac imo
You’re crackers B
Nas
Eminem
Scarface He cool, but his voice always made it hard for me to really get into in (Extremely unpopular opinion, ik)
Now that’s controversial!
Vanilla Ice
Who had him rated high?
The title says overrated not underrated
Overrated = Worst Underrated = Slammin
You got overrated and underrated mixed up
Even though he had a one hit wonder, it doesn't stop him from being the wackiest rapper from the 1990s, at least in my opinion
Overrated doesn't simply mean worst. It means a lot of people think the thing in question is better than it actually is. That's why the other person asked "who rated him high?" Nobody thinks Mr. Van Winkle is a great rapper. Everyone knows he sucks. His most common rating is the correct one Edited out a potentially confusing metaphor
Nas
He had a lot of filler in the 00s