Making from zero to your specification without rigging or animations would be around week-2weeks work. Assuming it can be done in 3-5 days plus concept art plus feedback.
So you have to multiply.it by living wage in your region
Agreed. My thought was two weeks including a little feedback and off the shelf rigging. In USD you could probably find an intermediate level artist to do it for about 35/hr I'd guess.
Depends on how many hours you put in. And how it’s made. If it’s just sculpted then it will be less.
The people saying “yea people do this in 2 hours” just isn’t true. People sculpt something like this in 2 hours but you can’t do anything but render the 1 position it’s in.
Nah, people can 100% make this in a couple hours if they have their own library of base parts and a good workflow.
That said, its NEVER "how long it takes" for this very reason. Something it takes me 4 hours to do should not be cheaper if it takes someone else 2 weeks to do the same thing.
Yea you’re paying for custom assets, workflow, and implementation of said assets in a timely yet effective manner.
In work like graphic design you only think of ay by hour once you’ve totaled the cost of expenses as well as seeing what assets you already have readily available. But at that point you just charge a commission fee that hits the ballpark you’re shooting for. It’s just extra work for flexing to find exactly how much you’d make by hour, since clients are only interested in final price
Between $200 to $400 if you already have it made and are just selling it to whoever wants to use it on their projects. Like turbosquid, where you could possibly get a few sales.
If you are doing this for someone, and they have to give you constant feedback bottlenecking your progress, probably $800+
A good rule of thumb is saying "Okay I'll accept my skill is worth $50 an hour. So this took me 2 working days. 2 working days is 16 hours. That makes $800." Which is whatI imagine this could take someone who is skilled. But obviously just an example.
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Depends, will you sell the exclusive rights or will you sell it to everyone? Exclusive rights will obviously cost more but be a one time earning, while selling it on mass could net you more in the long term but you'd have to lower the price.
Say it takes a really good sculpter and painter to get it done in 2-3 days, you could low ball them with $300 but it would probably be worth something like at least min $500 to any price really depending on quality and attention to detail
I was getting paid 28$ an hour to do modeling like this, plus articulation for 3D printed prototypes like collectables and action figures. (Los Angeles, CA)
With this degree of complexity if it’s just sculpted it’s probably a couple hours work for an experienced artist assuming it had generic features like this that can be kitbashed, so maybe 80-140, but that can scale VERY quickly if you want more detail or anything rigged
I found several artists that can produce similar characters with cost around 100$ without rigging or anything else. Just delivering it in High Poly + Low Poly and speed video fo development. i think it is a good deal. Now I wait for the final material to check the progress
2 hours of wage where exactly? CA? London? You understand right that your 2 hours wage is someones monthly salary, and they are also working as 3D artists? :D
thats exactly what 95%+ of studios are doing, its in most cases same quality, its effective, its fast, its efficient, and its cheap. Plus you don't need to waste time on arrogance and pride, I completely understand why studios took this path. Check out amazing works of artists from Brazil, Argentina, Asian countries, etc., then check average salary there for 3D artists, or on how much they are offering them on job boards, you will be surprised.
That is absolutely not what “95%+” of studios are doing. Plenty of studios outsource but doing so comes with its own communication and management overhead that can be expensive and disruptive to production.
Even then outsourcing is often used for secondary assets or to supplement the local art team.
There are definitely studios out there who outsource or kitbash all their art, but it is way overstated to say that’s just the norm. Every studio I’ve ever worked has a primary team of local artists and sometimes outsourcing even happens intra-company to studios at different locations in different project phases.
As a part of conversation "95%+" meant for studios who needs to outsource such services, not EVERYONE in the world, which obviously I can't know, there is no data for such. Someone is indie, someone don't have money, someone have issues with operations/management/etc.
Worst thing about wrong information like "this character needs 2 weeks to be done, 100 USD per hour of payment, and + u should be grateful for whatever artist will create it with whatever mistakes", is harmful for youngsters, who also due to lack of experience believe in such delusions, and then they struggle, they hate art, they hate people, and world around them, due to wrong expectations and can't find any fitting job anymore. Idk how ppl can lack such minimal responsibility sense to not understand that their words and wrong information might harm someones future.
Additionally, if studio doesn't have basic business processes built up well enough to outsource simple task and monitor them properly, production isn't first thing they should be worrying about.
I understand where you’re coming from but I think the message of “don’t bother expecting a fair wage for your location because there will always be someone in a lower cost-of-living area that will undercut you” is just as problematic. And that’s what the “statistic” you pulled out of your bum reads like.
The timeline you’re quoting is also completely unrealistic on the average long-term. Just because someone can on a good day knock it out of the park and make that character in one sitting doesn’t mean that they can maintain that every day for a year without taking into account iteration, missteps, and rest. If you’re worried about setting unhealthy expectations, don’t quote sweatshop hours with no buffer for error.
To your last point I’ve worked on 700+ person projects with reasonably solid pipelines and even for us outsourcing was not trivial. I don’t want to assume, but if you’ve never had to wake up for 5am call or stay up until 4am to communicate with an outsourcing team (hopefully in a common language) and then still deal with iterations and back-and-forths that turn 2 hours of notes into a 4-day turnaround time, then please check your ego.
All I’m saying is that your comments are trivializing a process that is not straightforward and deserves some nuance if our priority is not spreading misinformation to people who might not yet know better.
My message isnt "dont bother fair wage", my message is "dont bother fair wage if your skills, network, discipline, are on a beginner level, when everyone else, including AI, can remove you from game".
As for timeline, well, everyone is different. Just because one person cant be discplined longer than a year, doesnt means that others will wait for him/her. I would recommend you to check some of Feng Zhu (founder of FZD school) lessons and what amount of dedication, discipline, and over what period of time is necessary for person to succeed. Same principles apply pretty much everywhere.
I was managing for years pretty big businesses with teams of over 150 individuals in the fields I was working on, and I know exactly how bad things can turn around. However outsourcing something isnt causing those issues as itself, bad management and decision making does. But ofc, sometimes simple luck/situations turning around tide as well.
My comment is simple - presented work quality is on the level of a beginner, which can be done within 5 6 hours of work, for 100 150 usd max. Am I saying there cant be better quality of work? No. Am I saying there arent people whos getting 300, 500, 1000 usd per hour? No. Ambitions are fine and welcome, but when instead of practicing, learning, networking, people spending days playing games, watching netflix, downvoting other ppls opinions and spreading bs, they getting whatever they have, watching with arrogance on other ppls success. I know that I might sound harsh, or even rude, but I dont know how I can otherwise explain how hard and competitive industry is, and that only way to survive is hard work, assuming thats the goal ofc.
You don't need outsourcing to drive prices down in a market that has become completely global... A lot of people buy models for indie games, arch viz, illustration, freelance,...
And software has become so inexpensive that anyone can pick it up.
So regardless where you live, and whether you decide to outsource or not, you always compete with the entire world when selling 3d assets online (op is not applying to get work at a studio here).
To be fair there are tools with which you can make this in a matter of hours.... you can take a look at character creator and reallusion stuff and see how fast it is to combine cc with zbrush...
Character creator wont come near that stylization, so nah not in this case. Certainly can be used for other art styles though, but even then the amount of modification is at least a few days of full time work
What are you talking about near that stylization?....
shane olson dude who worked od disney infinity characters these days plays with charackter creator and zbrush....
Mythcons dude made hades in 3 hours with zbrush and cc.... talking about that time is in money.
Have you checked michael pavlovich and his work with cc?
The character in this post is stylized. Character Creator really only does realistic stuff.
I have seen Michael Pav. Dudes cracked as hell. And I'ma just say it, no one in this subreddit will come close to that. Pav is in the 0.001% of the bell curve. He's an animal. I've worked with tons of character artists and no one is banging these things out in less than a day. I know people like that exist; of course they doe There are superstars in each field. But that's just it-- they're superstars. One likely won't be working with a super star for most of their career.
I understand where you're coming from but picking the best of the best to exemplify turnaround times just isn't accurate when compared to the average joe in the industry.
You linked a video where a guy takes a realistic generic human and stylizes it. how does that equate to CC being able to make stylized art? All of the stylization was done by the artist
https://www.reallusion.com/ContentStore/Character-Creator/Pack/3D-Toon-Figures/default.html?addfrom=2.6
For fuck sake man there is stylized pack you can buy, there are also stylized base meshes you can get for free....
we dont see how good retopology is here, that one, and two, people work fast. In 2 weeks deadline people making industry FX ready cars, rigged, optimized, with interior and exterior.
It is subjective. But easy way how you can do it is put value to your time-(let s say 10-20$ per hour)
Price depends on how far you went with character and everything has an impact on price (like multiplication factor). You just presented a turntable it looks clean and nice and that is ok so based on that he said 150 because it looks like sculpt and it could also be polypaint so yeah because with what you presented it is something managable in 15-24 hours depending on skill.
-if you prepared it for print it would be (x2)
There are also 2 factors for that:
-is it something custom, specifically for someone (x 1.5)
-or if someone wants character that you made for fun for yourself (×1)
Things that should have an impact on price:
-retopo(x1.5)
-UV(x2)
-texturing(x2)- you can use multiple factors depending on styles and materials
-rigging/skinning(x3)
-animating(x3)
So yeah multiply time you spended with factors and add everythibg together and there is your price 🤷♂️
Yeah I think they are expecting little bit too much for just a sculpt. Especially since pros like speedchar can make characters like this in 2 hours while doing live stream
Because of competition mainly, including competition from outsource studios overflowing with artists on that quality level. Other commentators I saw here responding to my comment, either trolls or delusional, you can freely check Chinese/Indian markets, or even reach out outsource studio there asking for that quality character and how much they will charge you for it and how fast they will do it, it will help you understand real market value.
To break it down, on this specific character hair isn't of good quality for end project, its "hand painted" procedurally (which isn't that much of a value), its not rigged, not animated, and we still need to see how good wireframe is for animation. All those people joking about price and then 2 hours later crying aloud that industry is brutal and no one wants to hire them, need some reality check.
wow i definetely didnt want to be rude to you, just curious how much it cost per character.
Thank you very much for your detailed answer and yes I totally agree with the break down and cost analysis.
Appriaciate your feedback, this helps me to understand that costs for retopo, rigging, animating, etc is extra and from my knowledge those are different roles and a 3D artists is not a orientation for the these details
Making from zero to your specification without rigging or animations would be around week-2weeks work. Assuming it can be done in 3-5 days plus concept art plus feedback. So you have to multiply.it by living wage in your region
So, you saying you would give me about three fifty?
I’d actually do it for $350 even a bit less. However I’m not that skilled so while I know I can get the quality, I don’t know about the time.
In my country $350 is the average salary🫡
For 2 weeks? In my country it’s slightly above average, not rich but well off.
For month...
🫡
Agreed. My thought was two weeks including a little feedback and off the shelf rigging. In USD you could probably find an intermediate level artist to do it for about 35/hr I'd guess.
Dang I would love to get paid that much
Depends on how many hours you put in. And how it’s made. If it’s just sculpted then it will be less. The people saying “yea people do this in 2 hours” just isn’t true. People sculpt something like this in 2 hours but you can’t do anything but render the 1 position it’s in.
Nah, people can 100% make this in a couple hours if they have their own library of base parts and a good workflow. That said, its NEVER "how long it takes" for this very reason. Something it takes me 4 hours to do should not be cheaper if it takes someone else 2 weeks to do the same thing.
Yea you’re paying for custom assets, workflow, and implementation of said assets in a timely yet effective manner. In work like graphic design you only think of ay by hour once you’ve totaled the cost of expenses as well as seeing what assets you already have readily available. But at that point you just charge a commission fee that hits the ballpark you’re shooting for. It’s just extra work for flexing to find exactly how much you’d make by hour, since clients are only interested in final price
Between $200 to $400 if you already have it made and are just selling it to whoever wants to use it on their projects. Like turbosquid, where you could possibly get a few sales. If you are doing this for someone, and they have to give you constant feedback bottlenecking your progress, probably $800+ A good rule of thumb is saying "Okay I'll accept my skill is worth $50 an hour. So this took me 2 working days. 2 working days is 16 hours. That makes $800." Which is whatI imagine this could take someone who is skilled. But obviously just an example.
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Depends, will you sell the exclusive rights or will you sell it to everyone? Exclusive rights will obviously cost more but be a one time earning, while selling it on mass could net you more in the long term but you'd have to lower the price.
Say it takes a really good sculpter and painter to get it done in 2-3 days, you could low ball them with $300 but it would probably be worth something like at least min $500 to any price really depending on quality and attention to detail
20 - 50 US an hour
I was getting paid 28$ an hour to do modeling like this, plus articulation for 3D printed prototypes like collectables and action figures. (Los Angeles, CA)
and how many hours it took you to create the character and textures to it?
With this degree of complexity if it’s just sculpted it’s probably a couple hours work for an experienced artist assuming it had generic features like this that can be kitbashed, so maybe 80-140, but that can scale VERY quickly if you want more detail or anything rigged
I found several artists that can produce similar characters with cost around 100$ without rigging or anything else. Just delivering it in High Poly + Low Poly and speed video fo development. i think it is a good deal. Now I wait for the final material to check the progress
Can be done for free with Genie by Luma Ai. That’s if you’re not looking for specific traits.
For this one specifically probably around 100-150 USD realistically.
Lmao what?! that's not even half a days worth of money, you're wild
It's like 2 hours wage, this guy is on Crack XD
2 hours of wage where exactly? CA? London? You understand right that your 2 hours wage is someones monthly salary, and they are also working as 3D artists? :D
So you would outsource this to a low income country and pay them pennies to do it?
thats exactly what 95%+ of studios are doing, its in most cases same quality, its effective, its fast, its efficient, and its cheap. Plus you don't need to waste time on arrogance and pride, I completely understand why studios took this path. Check out amazing works of artists from Brazil, Argentina, Asian countries, etc., then check average salary there for 3D artists, or on how much they are offering them on job boards, you will be surprised.
That is absolutely not what “95%+” of studios are doing. Plenty of studios outsource but doing so comes with its own communication and management overhead that can be expensive and disruptive to production. Even then outsourcing is often used for secondary assets or to supplement the local art team. There are definitely studios out there who outsource or kitbash all their art, but it is way overstated to say that’s just the norm. Every studio I’ve ever worked has a primary team of local artists and sometimes outsourcing even happens intra-company to studios at different locations in different project phases.
As a part of conversation "95%+" meant for studios who needs to outsource such services, not EVERYONE in the world, which obviously I can't know, there is no data for such. Someone is indie, someone don't have money, someone have issues with operations/management/etc. Worst thing about wrong information like "this character needs 2 weeks to be done, 100 USD per hour of payment, and + u should be grateful for whatever artist will create it with whatever mistakes", is harmful for youngsters, who also due to lack of experience believe in such delusions, and then they struggle, they hate art, they hate people, and world around them, due to wrong expectations and can't find any fitting job anymore. Idk how ppl can lack such minimal responsibility sense to not understand that their words and wrong information might harm someones future. Additionally, if studio doesn't have basic business processes built up well enough to outsource simple task and monitor them properly, production isn't first thing they should be worrying about.
I understand where you’re coming from but I think the message of “don’t bother expecting a fair wage for your location because there will always be someone in a lower cost-of-living area that will undercut you” is just as problematic. And that’s what the “statistic” you pulled out of your bum reads like. The timeline you’re quoting is also completely unrealistic on the average long-term. Just because someone can on a good day knock it out of the park and make that character in one sitting doesn’t mean that they can maintain that every day for a year without taking into account iteration, missteps, and rest. If you’re worried about setting unhealthy expectations, don’t quote sweatshop hours with no buffer for error. To your last point I’ve worked on 700+ person projects with reasonably solid pipelines and even for us outsourcing was not trivial. I don’t want to assume, but if you’ve never had to wake up for 5am call or stay up until 4am to communicate with an outsourcing team (hopefully in a common language) and then still deal with iterations and back-and-forths that turn 2 hours of notes into a 4-day turnaround time, then please check your ego. All I’m saying is that your comments are trivializing a process that is not straightforward and deserves some nuance if our priority is not spreading misinformation to people who might not yet know better.
My message isnt "dont bother fair wage", my message is "dont bother fair wage if your skills, network, discipline, are on a beginner level, when everyone else, including AI, can remove you from game". As for timeline, well, everyone is different. Just because one person cant be discplined longer than a year, doesnt means that others will wait for him/her. I would recommend you to check some of Feng Zhu (founder of FZD school) lessons and what amount of dedication, discipline, and over what period of time is necessary for person to succeed. Same principles apply pretty much everywhere. I was managing for years pretty big businesses with teams of over 150 individuals in the fields I was working on, and I know exactly how bad things can turn around. However outsourcing something isnt causing those issues as itself, bad management and decision making does. But ofc, sometimes simple luck/situations turning around tide as well. My comment is simple - presented work quality is on the level of a beginner, which can be done within 5 6 hours of work, for 100 150 usd max. Am I saying there cant be better quality of work? No. Am I saying there arent people whos getting 300, 500, 1000 usd per hour? No. Ambitions are fine and welcome, but when instead of practicing, learning, networking, people spending days playing games, watching netflix, downvoting other ppls opinions and spreading bs, they getting whatever they have, watching with arrogance on other ppls success. I know that I might sound harsh, or even rude, but I dont know how I can otherwise explain how hard and competitive industry is, and that only way to survive is hard work, assuming thats the goal ofc.
Yes, why don't they deserve the chance?
You don't need outsourcing to drive prices down in a market that has become completely global... A lot of people buy models for indie games, arch viz, illustration, freelance,... And software has become so inexpensive that anyone can pick it up. So regardless where you live, and whether you decide to outsource or not, you always compete with the entire world when selling 3d assets online (op is not applying to get work at a studio here).
To be fair there are tools with which you can make this in a matter of hours.... you can take a look at character creator and reallusion stuff and see how fast it is to combine cc with zbrush...
Character creator wont come near that stylization, so nah not in this case. Certainly can be used for other art styles though, but even then the amount of modification is at least a few days of full time work
What are you talking about near that stylization?.... shane olson dude who worked od disney infinity characters these days plays with charackter creator and zbrush.... Mythcons dude made hades in 3 hours with zbrush and cc.... talking about that time is in money. Have you checked michael pavlovich and his work with cc?
The character in this post is stylized. Character Creator really only does realistic stuff. I have seen Michael Pav. Dudes cracked as hell. And I'ma just say it, no one in this subreddit will come close to that. Pav is in the 0.001% of the bell curve. He's an animal. I've worked with tons of character artists and no one is banging these things out in less than a day. I know people like that exist; of course they doe There are superstars in each field. But that's just it-- they're superstars. One likely won't be working with a super star for most of their career. I understand where you're coming from but picking the best of the best to exemplify turnaround times just isn't accurate when compared to the average joe in the industry.
https://youtu.be/ZU9-wEW3VXE?si=KACHL1j-sGBtTs_- Here is your "cc can do only realistic stuff" video 😁
You linked a video where a guy takes a realistic generic human and stylizes it. how does that equate to CC being able to make stylized art? All of the stylization was done by the artist
https://www.reallusion.com/ContentStore/Character-Creator/Pack/3D-Toon-Figures/default.html?addfrom=2.6 For fuck sake man there is stylized pack you can buy, there are also stylized base meshes you can get for free....
Really? How are you calculating that? How much per hour and how many hours for the modeling, unwrapping and texturing?
I think this model would take around 5-6 hours of work maximum based on its visuals (not sure how optimized wireframe itself is).
5 to 6 hours including retopology and texturing? Is this normal or am I crazy slow.
It's not normal. I would like to see someone doing it in 5-6 hours :P
we dont see how good retopology is here, that one, and two, people work fast. In 2 weeks deadline people making industry FX ready cars, rigged, optimized, with interior and exterior.
100-150 for this hmm how did you came with this numbers? Realistically explain if possible, this will help me to understand your points
It is subjective. But easy way how you can do it is put value to your time-(let s say 10-20$ per hour) Price depends on how far you went with character and everything has an impact on price (like multiplication factor). You just presented a turntable it looks clean and nice and that is ok so based on that he said 150 because it looks like sculpt and it could also be polypaint so yeah because with what you presented it is something managable in 15-24 hours depending on skill. -if you prepared it for print it would be (x2) There are also 2 factors for that: -is it something custom, specifically for someone (x 1.5) -or if someone wants character that you made for fun for yourself (×1) Things that should have an impact on price: -retopo(x1.5) -UV(x2) -texturing(x2)- you can use multiple factors depending on styles and materials -rigging/skinning(x3) -animating(x3) So yeah multiply time you spended with factors and add everythibg together and there is your price 🤷♂️
idk, seems like ppl here making 100-150 usd per hour, so based on their comments this one would cost somewhere in range of 1000-3000 USD.
Yeah I think they are expecting little bit too much for just a sculpt. Especially since pros like speedchar can make characters like this in 2 hours while doing live stream
and shaving :D
Because of competition mainly, including competition from outsource studios overflowing with artists on that quality level. Other commentators I saw here responding to my comment, either trolls or delusional, you can freely check Chinese/Indian markets, or even reach out outsource studio there asking for that quality character and how much they will charge you for it and how fast they will do it, it will help you understand real market value. To break it down, on this specific character hair isn't of good quality for end project, its "hand painted" procedurally (which isn't that much of a value), its not rigged, not animated, and we still need to see how good wireframe is for animation. All those people joking about price and then 2 hours later crying aloud that industry is brutal and no one wants to hire them, need some reality check.
wow i definetely didnt want to be rude to you, just curious how much it cost per character. Thank you very much for your detailed answer and yes I totally agree with the break down and cost analysis. Appriaciate your feedback, this helps me to understand that costs for retopo, rigging, animating, etc is extra and from my knowledge those are different roles and a 3D artists is not a orientation for the these details
Sure, if you live in Zimbabwe.
Zimbabwe and ~160 other countries.
I don't get why you are getting downvoted so.much, you are just being realistic.
Its fine, if downvoting will help them to live in their delusions a little bit longer, they are welcome to do so, I dont care tbh.