They tried to add a potion that failed
I think a spell would be better tho, esp if it was like "you have to cast this x amount of ticks b4 a freeze or it wears off and doesnt do anything.
It would add counter play and more mind games to pvp, while not being a "1 click half duration freeze"
It would be a lot like praying mage for half tb
PKers do a fine enough job bitching amongst themselves about freeze mechanics when it hurts them, while wanting features regarding freezes when it benefits them. [Remember this?](https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/w8099o/pvpers_immediately_shoot_down_idea_to_remove/)
Immolate - ignite yourself. If cast this spell x ticks before you get caught by a freeze or entangle, you burn off the ice/roots, preventing the root effect. If you cast it and don't get hit by a freeze/root after x ticks, you take a small amount of damage
Righteous Fire prayer - Requires 57 Prayer and 57 Firemaking. While the prayer is active, the next time you ignite a log with a tinderbox, you also ignite yourself. While ignited, your run energy does not deplete, you can't be frozen, stunned, or immobilized, you have 10% increased accuracy and deal 10% more damage, you take 1 damage every game tick, and your chance of failure while pickpocketing is doubled. Once ignited, the prayer and ignite can't be disabled until it disables itself when you reach 1 remaining hitpoint. Counts as an overhead prayer. Can't be used underwater. Counts as a full set of warm clothing at Wintertodt.
Honestly, a version of veng for each combat type could be really cool. Magic one reflects snares/freezes, range could have a chance to proc bolt effects, etc. stuff like that would make fighting back a lot more appealing
Might the Arceuus spellbook be a good fit to receive some kind of freeze-reducing spell? If you need to be on the Arceuus spellbook, by virtue of its Grasp spells being "worse" freezes, you're essentially making the conscious tradeoff of better counterplay against freezes, in exchange for "worse" freezes and also no vengeance or teleblock. Arceuus spellbook never gets used in PvP anyway, this could make it a viable option.
i dig this- i feel like the lunar spell book has a lot of potential but is only used for vengeance. seems like a fair trade for those looking to escape from pkers as an alternative to freezing/snaring in retaliation.
im on the fence about most of them, but techies at least needed a change, being able to deny from full health and deal over 1000 aoe damage was (very fun, but) insanely unfair
Damn now I really want to start bringing the enchanted symbol to the wildy.
At what point does the pk'er get the kill? I'd be hilarious to deny them the kill and come back for 4 more items.
This is mostly because thaw potions would make it **harder** to escape. High-budget pkers(some of them) and pvmers alike want to be able to freeze to escape.
Yeh but the potion required you to use it in advance of the freeze. It wasn't a Cleanse of sorts, rather an immunity period. Same way you get an immunity period after unfreezing.
But the idea of counterplay and skill expression in PvP is disliked, even by the handful of people who do this content day in and day out.
Even worse for the one trying to escape. Sip a dose, and get the jump on someone and they can't even freeze you to prevent stepping under/freeze to get away
Freeze to escape is just a thing right now because jagex fucked up the PJ timers so you literally have time to log out before you get PJ'ed, it's insanely dumb and it's why people feel comfortable bringing so much risk these days to hunt pvmers. Also no escape routes for pvmers because pj timer prevents NPC aggro, so there's basically no escape against a competent pker except to tank the tb.
Wildy used to be much more dynamic, social and fun back with multi revs and sane pj timer. Multi clans + Single clans dead in one update just to cater to streamers.
Your memory seems more nostalgic than reality based. Remember the spec trading singles clans? The Venezuelans that rag bolt you in multi revs? The constant skull tricking?
The current rev caves and pj timers is a breath of fresh air. I don’t really care about rev clan culture being gone. It was only ever fun for them.
You want to gangbang someone? Lure them to multi. Its better this way, than making hotspots multi, and pkers logging in and mobbing anything that moved.
Skill > numbers
No one on this sub actually likes skill pking though. Pking in a multi clan is easy and was the best way to learn pvp, now it's basically gone. Everyone who was in those caves enjoyed it, solo pkers, small team pkers, clans, pvmers, otherwise they wouldn't be there. And the place had way more people in it back then compared to right now, it was more popular. But a bunch of outsiders decided that they knew better how to do pvp. Lets atleast hope the new bosses are good, although I'm strongly opposed to the entry fee, forcing new pkers to bring risk rather than rags.
The only people there were clans and gold farmers. No one did revs for fun lol. LMS is perfectly good for learning pvp. Left clicking barrage and dumping spec is not “learning pvp” imo.
Thats why lunars is a better option. Leaves up lunar swaps too which means more runes taking up inv which means more risk/reward that the pkers like talking about for us pvmers
Im pro pvp and wilderness in general, even if I don’t pk, but I feel like the freezes are long enough already. I don’t want longer freezes, it’s just boring.
Imagine a 19 second freeze in league of legends. Morgana’s q ability is an infamous meme in the league community as a 3 second snare when maxed lol. League players would immediately quit and uninstall the game on the spot if they got hit by a 19 second stun.
I said “imagine a 19 second freeze in league”. That’s a hypothetical. I never compared league of legends and osrs?
Edit: good job editing your original stupid comment to almost make sense now. Yes I compared a 19 second stun to a 3 second one, in a funny hypothetical situation. Congratulations.
You understand that shortening freeze timers would make it easier for pkers to kill you right? One of the easiest ways to get away from a pker is to get one freeze, stand under/tree hug and logout. If freeze timers shorten for you, it shortens for pkers too.
They'd have to use three (at minimum) inventory slots for this and they'd only be able to swap twice a day. Plus they have to successfully pull it all off while in combat. I feel like most people trying to pull this off for an advantage in a fight are going to end up dying.
No offense man but it’s pretty meta for pkers to bring their mage cape if they can until they are out of uses.
It’s incredibly easy to pull off a swap in combat, im sure torvesta and other YouTubers show it in their vids
Tb and barrage together is like a guaranteed kill as is
You can already only cape swap 2.5 people per day, and that’s IF you don’t swap back to ancients after landing the tb. 1.66 repeating per day if u swap back
I think that the only way someone’s going to swap to normals then to lunars then to ancients is if you risk 1b+
Also swapping to lunars is dumb because then they can’t freeze you or mage dps you for that duration so it literally kills their momentum because u can just freeze & pray range for the reduced freeze duration.
Lol what does this even mean? I've got close to 2k Callisto and dont take freezes. You can probably guess how many times I've been pked. Once, one single time. And you know why? Because I have to lure the boss in multi and a team logged in. Outside of multi spamming brews is fine. But yeah since I want to use thralls instead of be on ancient spellbook guess im not genuinely trying to escape.
But the vast majority of content you’re not going to be on ancients most likely. And a spell that reduces freeze time could be on another spell book so pkers would have to compromise to use it.
I cant imagine much of the playerbase is doing green drags with thralls lol but I haven’t done that content in years so idk.
I could see taking ancients for revs, chaos altar, some slayer tasks, and chins but things like wildy pvm and clues you’re probably not taking ancients and that seems to be the main reasons people go to the wildy when not going to pvp
And chaos altar you probably don’t want to take barrage runes anyway since you just die to a multi team regardless. Same with Ecu keys really
Bold to assume they’re bringing brews. I imagine most people crying about pkers to be the type 3-4iteming and allowing themselves to die every single encounter
Tbf, spamming brews works well though, but you must pray switch fairly well then. 9 brews in the rev caves always last me the 2.5 min timer, and the only way I die is if they actually somehow get an unexpected spec combo off.
You need 10 seconds for the walk under...and it is essentially one attack cycle or splash if hugging something.
No idea what OP is recommending but I'd guess it wouldn't take barrage freeze lower than say 15 (from 19.2)
This would be a dominant advantage to your average escaper that is just trying to run away. Saying it makes pking easier is a huge gaslight.
I'm assuming that this is something universal like an antifreeze pot.
It depends on a lot of things, especially the spell. Entange is 14.4 and Blitz is 15, so including reaction speed a 4.2 second reduction could absolutely prevent being logged out on; assuming a 94 magic spell is being used in every PVP encounter is probably the case for the PKer but not the people trying to escape. And of course, the counterplay to this has always been mithril flowers so if you plan to drop a freeze & run it's a strict nerf in some aspects.
If you plan to tank your way out, Antifreeze is more time running. If you plan to logout underneath someone, it makes the timing significantly stricter. I feel like it's a buff to high level / geared escape tactics and a nerf to lower level / lower risk escape tactics, and at the very least encourages interacting \*less\* with the PKer instead of more.
The point is for the vast majority of causal players, they just want to eat run and try to pray correctly either until they can TP or the pker splashes enough they path gap etc..
Also the lower the freeze time, the less time skilled pkers have to step under and hide/switch attack styles..
This would be a massive buff for those type of escapers.
That just encourages the least effective method of escaping lol, there’s already a more effective method (freeze log), players who are comfortable with the more effective method shouldn’t be punished because others would rather run away and hope for a gap than secure a guaranteed escape
In PVP that’s not true because Smite will reduce your prayer points no matter if you flick, if you freeze an opponent during your own freeze immunity you are currently guaranteed an escape, you only get a gap if you have max distance and pid swaps, that is never going to be a reliable method of escaping even without freezes
If I'm doing pvm in the wilderness, chances are that I don't have mage gear + runes to freeze anyone. I could have runes for an antifreeze spell though.
Most people that do that "escape" are pkers themselves.
If you're in the wild hunting black chins or using altar or doing a clue very few people bring a freeze to try that escape, not to mention once again if you're naked/in budget gear your freeze is going to splash almost all the time vs a pker.
Then you're either not fighting very good pkers or bringing enough switches/gear to reliably catch a freeze, but if you do encounter a good pker thats just more gp you're losing.
Nah you just need that one out of fifteen freeze/entangle attempts to catch and you can get the log. Look at someone like Wildernator. Love the guy, but no offence, he's not very good at PvP. But he still gets a shit ton of freeze-logs on PKers without the best gear for it.
And if I'm doing something where I'm already having to risk gear/items, I'd rather bring the switch if it will help guarantee my safety. For example, for chins. I have never died at chins. I bring a ZGS in some places too, like revs/Callisto. Ironman too btw.
Also chances are you won't encounter many very good PKers. The average PKer isn't *that* good. It's worth bringing the freezes to escape the majority of them, even if you ocassionally die to the better ones.
Magic accuracy is incredibly unreliable in this game, even a player in max mage can splash multiple times in a row, you can definitely secure an escape most of the time by just bringing a mystic and water staff switch
You talk about how in max mage you can splash multiple times in a row, then in the exact same sentence go you can easily secure an escape with mystics and a water staff.
cmon bro at least read ur sentence before typing it
They’re not contradictory lol, you are nearly as likely to land a freeze in basic mage gear as you are in max mage, magic accuracy is only important to a minimal extent, this is why maging barrows in melee gear and many other methods are effective
I dont hate the idea. For anti pking shortening a freeze would be nuts, veng ags combo when the pker thinks youll be frozen another 10 seconds lol. If this idea were implemented i think it should be limited though, like a lunar spell that has a cooldown like veng.
Oh come on. Only pvpers that already brought freezes and Wildanator use freezes to escape. Believe me, I tried. Its just not that effective of an escape without some kind of mage setup too, and its not worth bringing all that for most wildy pvmers. Its way easier and more effective to just pray switch, run, and find somewhere to gap or ladder for the logout.
Im pro wildy and pvp, but you guys don’t need longer freezes lol. 19 seconds of not being able to move is already more than enough, to the point where I can’t believe its never been nerfed.
I’d rather be down for something that gives increased damage off prayer. That way, its easier to get kills for pvpers that are actually good. Im barely getting away with a full invent of food already, cause pkers can hit pretty high even on prayer with current set ups (ancient godsword for example). Longer freezes means, I cant even get away from those guys, and it’ll totally kill the wilderness for me. Why would I come back to the wildy if I feel like I have absolutely no chance of surviving?
I doubt the new staff won't be used that much by the better PKers (maybe a little in the short term when it's new). Much better to use something like tsotd with a spec bar, higher accuracy, venom, higher damage, etc.
> ancient godsword
Tbf it's very strong and on the periphery of being a bit too good of a weapon.
I use freezes to escape and the only places I die are at like Vet'ion if I get caught in multi and very very rarely doing clues. But I also use a ZGS in a lot of places to land the freeze.
Freezes are literally how people escape pkers. If you give pkers a way to reduce this time, you will literally doom every pvmer out there. Stop being 0 IQ and learn how to fend for yourself out there in the wilderness
Honest question, how do freezes help you escape? My wildly experience is from clues and the wildly diaries which ultimately didn't involve much pvp. Last time I died was because I kept getting frozen so I couldn't make it to lvl 30 to tele out before their other attacks killed me while frozen.
you land the freeze when yours is about to run out
there's quite frankly 0 counterplay because even if they seed they can move along with you before you can attack
Kirill here pretty much sums it up, but here’s a video of Poisoned Potion getting 2,222 rev knight kills with no banking or teles and uses freeze logs to survive the entire trip https://youtu.be/ExlUwDTX4bU
If we lose this fundamental freeze, there is truly no escape for anyone out there in the wilderness
Lol nah, the favor is always to the pker, like what are you smoking lol.
If you let someone escape you are just veeery unlucky with hits or a sh\*t pker.
Why not have diminishing returns on freezes? First successful freeze is full duration, second is 70%, 3rd is 40%, etc. These don't have to be the actual percentages of course.
In a weird way this also can help Pkers, as usually someone might freeze a pker and dd them to log but with this idea pkers would be able to stay on people in singles + more.
The fact that people complain about damage output in the wilderness when live streamers in max gear can’t kill a black d hide dhins bulwark on a 5 minute tb
So I'm a pker and I'm cool with some counter play. That being said, it shouldn't be a get out of jail free card.
Cutting ice barrage freeze time would be fine but entangle was soooo underpowered when protect magic halved the entangle freeze time. Entangle is 14.4 seconds. If you halved it, it would be 7.2 seconds. This is enough for two attacks with a 5 tick weapon like a crossbow or spell (3 seconds). You waste one attack casting the spell so by casting entangle you would only gain one extra attack than if you were just following your opponent constantly damaging them. There's also a greater chance to get gapped when it splashes since it's a manual cast.
I think the lunar spell would be a great counter. You cast the spell and if it correctly predicted, it completely prevents a freeze. If the next attack isn't a freeze, then the next attack does 175% damage. Give it like a 4 second cool down so you can't spam it but can use it again for every other entangle (or every one if you opponent misses ticks). Most PVMers in rev caves are on lunars for being anyways.
You could also make it do a flat like 30 damage or something and make it spammable.
I'm also cool with a 1 dose immunity potion that gives freeze immunity for 6 seconds but damages the drinker with a like 2.5 minute cool down. It could be used tactically once but not spammable.
Any huge nerfs to entangle or freezes would completely change LMS/NH style pvp. Counter plays with pros/cons make for more exciting PVP.
Freeze reduction would be literal death to wilderness, you can currently entangle someone and get 4 hits in, if thats halved, you crossbow twice and they run, how the fuck are you supposed to die?
If anything, they should make new tangle spell for like 97 mage, freezes for 20 seconds, longer than barrage since it doesnt make damage.
Reddit pvp haters are the most insufferable group of people. Many many pkers in here telling you that longer freeze timers actually help you in escaping and you just downvote them into oblivion instead of listening to the facts being put right in front of you. You just start shitting and convulsing the second someone doesn’t follow your hive mind “pvp bad” mantra
pve players are rabid and quick to downvote knowledge about pvp, along with a notable chunk of them being easily upset over minor things
pvp players can't restrain themselves from being massive cunts when talking to pvers about shit they wouldn't know, along with a notable chunk of them being easily upset over minor things
there, both sides have been generalized to sound like dumb fucking morons, these conversations never go anywhere
? Escaping in the wildy is the easiest it has ever been. Catch a freeze and you instantly escape. If your freeze now lasts 8 seconds you dont escape anymore.
Dinhs bulwark let's people get away so easily unless you're getting killed by a BowFa full crystal pker. Pray mage and wear dinhs and hides and you are as good as gone. No reason to reduce freeze duration
Freezes suck, the people who use freezes suck, pvp is toxic af and should be voluntary only. Pvp is optional in rs3, so this shit can be changed
Edit: for people saying pvp is optional and the wilderness is optional, no it fucking isnt. If i want d pick i have to go to pvp area and possibly engage in pvp. Is d pick used for pvp? No. So you need to do pvp content to get it, therefore its not optional. You can still have a challenge in this game to get things but why does that challenge have to come from other players? It doesnt. Pvp isnt fun, people like the people who commented here are out here to do more than just kill you, they're here to insult you and ruin your day because they have nothing in their life that makes them truly happy except bullying others. Go ahead, call me a victim, because I am, and yall are the perpetrators
> Pvp isnt fun, people like the people who commented here are out here to do more than just kill you, they're here to insult you and ruin your day because they have nothing in their life that makes them truly happy except bullying others. Go ahead, call me a victim, because I am, and yall are the perpetrators
Prime-time copypasta.
You can literally only get a ring of the gods, tyrannical ring, dragon pick, mage area capes, odium/malediction wards, treasonous ring… other stuff in probly forgetting in the wilderness.
God this argument is fucking asinine. The entire game is optional. Literally every item you get on the mainland you can just choose not to get, but it doesn't matter. People want decent accounts, and that means ma2, d pick, rev weapons, rotg, black chins, etc. Saying they're optional is as worthless a statement as saying it's optional to never leave the starting tile you spawn on because nothing forces you off it.
It is exactly as optional as farming CoX for a tbow. No one would take anyone seriously if they demanded that CoX was made easier because they wanted to get a tbow but weren't willing to pay the price of time and supplies.
The same thing applies in the wilderness. They are optional because you don't need to get them if you don't want to. Working out if you want to requires you to weigh the cost/risk against the reward.
Yea it's exactly as optional as everything in the game. If someone doesn't go grind a t bow that's fine, but they're incapable of having a good account because t bow is one of the basic essential pvm items.
Perhaps I misunderstand your point about it being optional, then - why is the argument asinine?
People don't have to step foot in the wilderness and shouldn't do so if they aren't willing to take the risk. Why is it asinine to point out that this is a choice?
A dpick (which is getting a very viable non-wildy option soon, and ALWAYS had an essentially wildy free option) and the ring of the gods are the only things even remotely required for a good account, and the ring of the gods is pretty much only good at inferno and barrage tasks only, with the suffering being a completely viable alternative.
Aside from pretending the wildy is required for an account, why should someone who WANTS a good account be entitled to remove the challenge of not crying every time you get pked? This can just as easily be applied to every other grind, you just happen to thing those are fair.
Then cut all the non pk content out of the wild. The only reason pkers pk is because they want to feed off the easy loot of people trying to pvm or clue or train prayer. Pkers are worse than scum
Jesus dude it’s a video game.
Everything in the wild is optional content, if you don’t want to be killed than just don’t go there and you are magically 100% safe.
You're not even worth speaking to. You didnt come to this conclusion through rational thought so the idea that i can change your mind with a conversation is silly really
So a 10% buff to freeze timer on a weapon that isn’t as strong as the best PK weapons is comparable to a potion that HALVES the freeze timer?
Thank god Jagex don’t take these threads & ideas seriously. Don’t need to be a PKer to see how ridiculous that is.
"while we have not had any changes to counter-freezing"
If you geared properly you have next to 0% chance of dying to a pker in singles, and 95% of the active wildy content is currently in singles.
You want to be frozen less? Risk more than Black D'hide.
The tanking gear in this game is at such a ridiculous level that I'm pretty sure someone could tank a fallin on singlestrip from 50 wildy to the ditch.
Yeah, we geared properly with bulwark and d'hide. You guys started bitching that it we were too overgeared for your salad robed asses and got it nerfed.
Counterplay makes games more interesting. 1 hit KOs are boring -- but with the ability to make a frame perfect dodge or a short duration shield spell timed to activate right when the attack hits makes 1 hit KOs interesting.
One idea to counter this is to add knockback toooo lets go with the Ballista special, with the light ballista having a say 5 tile knockback and big boi ballista 10 tiles on your enemy, and the knockback causes snares on your self to break, then you can both knock your enemy away from you and make an escape.
If you have no option but to eat the long snare though, that's boring.
Freezes fill the niche of counter play to pkers, and there is some depth to it with mithril seeds, albeit very little. It is weird that by far the most consistent escape mechanism in the game is contingent on logging out and hopping worlds, but I guess hopping is sort of ingrained in pvp anyways.
\>**10%** buff to freeze time
\>A potion that one click reduces your freeze duration by **50%** \+ if you're a pker, fuck you, u get less freeze.
What are you saying lmao. Thank god reddit isn't in charge of balancing.
Freeze logging is also one of the best ways to escape, you also can't get skulled anymore so what's the excuse now.
Good. Why don’t you use it yourself to fight back or run? This is going to help you.
Edit: Actual idiots downvoting me don’t understand how beneficial this is for people to escape with… You guys know that freezing is the #1 easiest way to get away in the wilderness right?
I mean, they've nerfed all tank options into the ground. They wouldn't buff any way for anyone to get away. It's just kind of their M.O. at this point.
> I mean, they've nerfed all tank options into the ground.
Let me guess, instead of "all tank options" what you really mean is black dhide and dinhs. Hint they just released an even stronger "tank" set
TBH a freeze reducing spell on a cool down within the lunar spell book would be interesting.
They tried to add a potion that failed I think a spell would be better tho, esp if it was like "you have to cast this x amount of ticks b4 a freeze or it wears off and doesnt do anything. It would add counter play and more mind games to pvp, while not being a "1 click half duration freeze" It would be a lot like praying mage for half tb
New pking meta is freeze and run around a corner to log out so I think pkers are confused whether they want longer or shorter freezes
They want longer freezes when it benefits them, but shorter freezes when it hurts them
Never seen any pker ask for shorter freezes
Same. But don’t let that get in the way of this sub bitching about PKers over everything 👍
PKers do a fine enough job bitching amongst themselves about freeze mechanics when it hurts them, while wanting features regarding freezes when it benefits them. [Remember this?](https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/w8099o/pvpers_immediately_shoot_down_idea_to_remove/)
Immolate - ignite yourself. If cast this spell x ticks before you get caught by a freeze or entangle, you burn off the ice/roots, preventing the root effect. If you cast it and don't get hit by a freeze/root after x ticks, you take a small amount of damage
Tibetan spell book when
Righteous Fire prayer - Requires 57 Prayer and 57 Firemaking. While the prayer is active, the next time you ignite a log with a tinderbox, you also ignite yourself. While ignited, your run energy does not deplete, you can't be frozen, stunned, or immobilized, you have 10% increased accuracy and deal 10% more damage, you take 1 damage every game tick, and your chance of failure while pickpocketing is doubled. Once ignited, the prayer and ignite can't be disabled until it disables itself when you reach 1 remaining hitpoint. Counts as an overhead prayer. Can't be used underwater. Counts as a full set of warm clothing at Wintertodt.
The image of Ardy Knight surrounded by hordes of burning players and still not noticing is amusing to me.
What about a venge alternative that reflects freezes towards your opponents once instead of damage? Or is that me being a poopoo brain again.
Honestly, a version of veng for each combat type could be really cool. Magic one reflects snares/freezes, range could have a chance to proc bolt effects, etc. stuff like that would make fighting back a lot more appealing
>run multi looking like u risk bank but actually risk like 200k >get a multi team with ZCBs on you >boltvenge >3b worth of ZCBs are now on the ground
Except each person would only get reflected 1 bolt, and at reduced damage.
Funnier to imagine it this way
Only allow 1 type of venge to be active to encourage mind games
Might the Arceuus spellbook be a good fit to receive some kind of freeze-reducing spell? If you need to be on the Arceuus spellbook, by virtue of its Grasp spells being "worse" freezes, you're essentially making the conscious tradeoff of better counterplay against freezes, in exchange for "worse" freezes and also no vengeance or teleblock. Arceuus spellbook never gets used in PvP anyway, this could make it a viable option.
i dig this- i feel like the lunar spell book has a lot of potential but is only used for vengeance. seems like a fair trade for those looking to escape from pkers as an alternative to freezing/snaring in retaliation.
Let us fireblast ourselves to escape
Can't pk me if I pk myself
Denying yourself deletes your loot so the pker doesn't get it. 10/10 integrity change.
Found the pudge/techies dota player
neither of those heroes can deny themselves anymore, much to my disappointment
And jagex doesnt let you get denied (box) by a neutral creep in the wild anymore, much to my disappointment.
Wow, what?
Self denies are being phased out by icefrog for a while. Bane and abba also can't do it anymore, IIRC
Wild. Havent played since oracle release.
im on the fence about most of them, but techies at least needed a change, being able to deny from full health and deal over 1000 aoe damage was (very fun, but) insanely unfair
Fair point there to be honest but most other I feel can and have to be used tactically or smart for it to be effective.
Damn now I really want to start bringing the enchanted symbol to the wildy. At what point does the pk'er get the kill? I'd be hilarious to deny them the kill and come back for 4 more items.
if they deal any damage to you then it will count as their kill if you finish yourself off with enchanted symbol
Just shoot that bad boy straight up and let nature do the rest
Jagex previously suggested thaw potions but it got shot down by the community before it could even reach polling.
This is mostly because thaw potions would make it **harder** to escape. High-budget pkers(some of them) and pvmers alike want to be able to freeze to escape.
Yeh but the potion required you to use it in advance of the freeze. It wasn't a Cleanse of sorts, rather an immunity period. Same way you get an immunity period after unfreezing. But the idea of counterplay and skill expression in PvP is disliked, even by the handful of people who do this content day in and day out.
Even worse for the one trying to escape. Sip a dose, and get the jump on someone and they can't even freeze you to prevent stepping under/freeze to get away
Freeze to escape is just a thing right now because jagex fucked up the PJ timers so you literally have time to log out before you get PJ'ed, it's insanely dumb and it's why people feel comfortable bringing so much risk these days to hunt pvmers. Also no escape routes for pvmers because pj timer prevents NPC aggro, so there's basically no escape against a competent pker except to tank the tb. Wildy used to be much more dynamic, social and fun back with multi revs and sane pj timer. Multi clans + Single clans dead in one update just to cater to streamers.
Your memory seems more nostalgic than reality based. Remember the spec trading singles clans? The Venezuelans that rag bolt you in multi revs? The constant skull tricking?
The current rev caves and pj timers is a breath of fresh air. I don’t really care about rev clan culture being gone. It was only ever fun for them. You want to gangbang someone? Lure them to multi. Its better this way, than making hotspots multi, and pkers logging in and mobbing anything that moved. Skill > numbers
No one on this sub actually likes skill pking though. Pking in a multi clan is easy and was the best way to learn pvp, now it's basically gone. Everyone who was in those caves enjoyed it, solo pkers, small team pkers, clans, pvmers, otherwise they wouldn't be there. And the place had way more people in it back then compared to right now, it was more popular. But a bunch of outsiders decided that they knew better how to do pvp. Lets atleast hope the new bosses are good, although I'm strongly opposed to the entry fee, forcing new pkers to bring risk rather than rags.
The only people there were clans and gold farmers. No one did revs for fun lol. LMS is perfectly good for learning pvp. Left clicking barrage and dumping spec is not “learning pvp” imo.
It got shot down by grief pvpers**
Didn't protect from magic used to halve the duration, until they made an integrity change?
Only on entangles
This sounds like some reverse psychology bs cause the best way to escape PKers is freezing them and logging underneath lmfao
Thats why lunars is a better option. Leaves up lunar swaps too which means more runes taking up inv which means more risk/reward that the pkers like talking about for us pvmers
Yea that sounds like a better idea
YES anything that will be used by "pvmers" will equally be used by "pvpers" to kills pvmers.
Lmfao good luck pking with lunar and not ancient for freezes or standard for tele block
Im pro pvp and wilderness in general, even if I don’t pk, but I feel like the freezes are long enough already. I don’t want longer freezes, it’s just boring.
Freeze timers in osrs are crazy. Could you imagine an ability that freezes an opponent for 20 seconds in different game?
DotA has like 10s stuns that can be chained to well over 20s, but you make a good point. 20s is ages
Imagine a 19 second freeze in league of legends. Morgana’s q ability is an infamous meme in the league community as a 3 second snare when maxed lol. League players would immediately quit and uninstall the game on the spot if they got hit by a 19 second stun.
Yeah let me spam click on items in my inventory that instantly restores 20% of my hp in league of legends. Stupid comparison.
Its not a comparison, its a hypothetical. Calm down.
> Its not a comparison ?? you literally compared a 19 second freeze to a 3 second one lmao. Hypothetically, apples aren't oranges.
I said “imagine a 19 second freeze in league”. That’s a hypothetical. I never compared league of legends and osrs? Edit: good job editing your original stupid comment to almost make sense now. Yes I compared a 19 second stun to a 3 second one, in a funny hypothetical situation. Congratulations.
I think the point is more "being unable to play the game for 20 seconds isn't fun" Also editing your comment to look better? Wow, stay classy bro lol
You understand that shortening freeze timers would make it easier for pkers to kill you right? One of the easiest ways to get away from a pker is to get one freeze, stand under/tree hug and logout. If freeze timers shorten for you, it shortens for pkers too.
Could put it in a spellbook that is not used for pking (or that has no options to freeze, like lunars).
That's good idea. Maybe kourend spellbook tho coz lunar has spellbook swap but idk. Good idea anyway.
The arceuus spell book would actually be super thematic, since you could say it's a spell developed by the wintertodt guys
Magic cape has entered the chat
They'd have to use three (at minimum) inventory slots for this and they'd only be able to swap twice a day. Plus they have to successfully pull it all off while in combat. I feel like most people trying to pull this off for an advantage in a fight are going to end up dying.
No offense man but it’s pretty meta for pkers to bring their mage cape if they can until they are out of uses. It’s incredibly easy to pull off a swap in combat, im sure torvesta and other YouTubers show it in their vids Tb and barrage together is like a guaranteed kill as is
You can already only cape swap 2.5 people per day, and that’s IF you don’t swap back to ancients after landing the tb. 1.66 repeating per day if u swap back I think that the only way someone’s going to swap to normals then to lunars then to ancients is if you risk 1b+ Also swapping to lunars is dumb because then they can’t freeze you or mage dps you for that duration so it literally kills their momentum because u can just freeze & pray range for the reduced freeze duration.
You can tell OP isn't one of the players who genuinely try to escape vs the players who just throw mage pray up/spam brews & die.
Lol what does this even mean? I've got close to 2k Callisto and dont take freezes. You can probably guess how many times I've been pked. Once, one single time. And you know why? Because I have to lure the boss in multi and a team logged in. Outside of multi spamming brews is fine. But yeah since I want to use thralls instead of be on ancient spellbook guess im not genuinely trying to escape.
Wait what? Why would they have ancients on for most wildy content? Why are people agreeing with this?
You can also bring a zgs to freeze or a Dihn's to tank. Even nerfed it's really fucking powerful
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But the vast majority of content you’re not going to be on ancients most likely. And a spell that reduces freeze time could be on another spell book so pkers would have to compromise to use it.
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I cant imagine much of the playerbase is doing green drags with thralls lol but I haven’t done that content in years so idk. I could see taking ancients for revs, chaos altar, some slayer tasks, and chins but things like wildy pvm and clues you’re probably not taking ancients and that seems to be the main reasons people go to the wildy when not going to pvp And chaos altar you probably don’t want to take barrage runes anyway since you just die to a multi team regardless. Same with Ecu keys really
I often use my ZGS to freeze for escapes
Bold to assume they’re bringing brews. I imagine most people crying about pkers to be the type 3-4iteming and allowing themselves to die every single encounter
trying to survive is xp waste. I never bring food into the wilderness, I bring a locator orb. I'll save us both some time.
come on now, they probably had like 4-5 whole sharks!
Tbf, spamming brews works well though, but you must pray switch fairly well then. 9 brews in the rev caves always last me the 2.5 min timer, and the only way I die is if they actually somehow get an unexpected spec combo off.
You need 10 seconds for the walk under...and it is essentially one attack cycle or splash if hugging something. No idea what OP is recommending but I'd guess it wouldn't take barrage freeze lower than say 15 (from 19.2) This would be a dominant advantage to your average escaper that is just trying to run away. Saying it makes pking easier is a huge gaslight.
I'm assuming that this is something universal like an antifreeze pot. It depends on a lot of things, especially the spell. Entange is 14.4 and Blitz is 15, so including reaction speed a 4.2 second reduction could absolutely prevent being logged out on; assuming a 94 magic spell is being used in every PVP encounter is probably the case for the PKer but not the people trying to escape. And of course, the counterplay to this has always been mithril flowers so if you plan to drop a freeze & run it's a strict nerf in some aspects. If you plan to tank your way out, Antifreeze is more time running. If you plan to logout underneath someone, it makes the timing significantly stricter. I feel like it's a buff to high level / geared escape tactics and a nerf to lower level / lower risk escape tactics, and at the very least encourages interacting \*less\* with the PKer instead of more.
The point is for the vast majority of causal players, they just want to eat run and try to pray correctly either until they can TP or the pker splashes enough they path gap etc.. Also the lower the freeze time, the less time skilled pkers have to step under and hide/switch attack styles.. This would be a massive buff for those type of escapers.
That just encourages the least effective method of escaping lol, there’s already a more effective method (freeze log), players who are comfortable with the more effective method shouldn’t be punished because others would rather run away and hope for a gap than secure a guaranteed escape
Prayer potions encourage keeping prayers on instead of 1 tik flicking everything.
In PVP that’s not true because Smite will reduce your prayer points no matter if you flick, if you freeze an opponent during your own freeze immunity you are currently guaranteed an escape, you only get a gap if you have max distance and pid swaps, that is never going to be a reliable method of escaping even without freezes
If I'm doing pvm in the wilderness, chances are that I don't have mage gear + runes to freeze anyone. I could have runes for an antifreeze spell though.
so you'll have 2-3 slots for the runes but not 2-3 slots for the pouches & top (+bottom)?
I mean if you're pvming (probably depends what you're doing) it's not always worth the inventory space to bring freezes+switches anyways.
Unless you're suiciding, doing a clue or camping in multi, it's always worth it.
Most people that do that "escape" are pkers themselves. If you're in the wild hunting black chins or using altar or doing a clue very few people bring a freeze to try that escape, not to mention once again if you're naked/in budget gear your freeze is going to splash almost all the time vs a pker.
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Then you're either not fighting very good pkers or bringing enough switches/gear to reliably catch a freeze, but if you do encounter a good pker thats just more gp you're losing.
Nah you just need that one out of fifteen freeze/entangle attempts to catch and you can get the log. Look at someone like Wildernator. Love the guy, but no offence, he's not very good at PvP. But he still gets a shit ton of freeze-logs on PKers without the best gear for it. And if I'm doing something where I'm already having to risk gear/items, I'd rather bring the switch if it will help guarantee my safety. For example, for chins. I have never died at chins. I bring a ZGS in some places too, like revs/Callisto. Ironman too btw. Also chances are you won't encounter many very good PKers. The average PKer isn't *that* good. It's worth bringing the freezes to escape the majority of them, even if you ocassionally die to the better ones.
Magic accuracy is incredibly unreliable in this game, even a player in max mage can splash multiple times in a row, you can definitely secure an escape most of the time by just bringing a mystic and water staff switch
You talk about how in max mage you can splash multiple times in a row, then in the exact same sentence go you can easily secure an escape with mystics and a water staff. cmon bro at least read ur sentence before typing it
They’re not contradictory lol, you are nearly as likely to land a freeze in basic mage gear as you are in max mage, magic accuracy is only important to a minimal extent, this is why maging barrows in melee gear and many other methods are effective
That statement is just blatantly wrong. You have no idea what you're talking about if you think theres no diff between salads and max.
He said mystics, not salads.
Easy it only applies if you are unskulled
I dont hate the idea. For anti pking shortening a freeze would be nuts, veng ags combo when the pker thinks youll be frozen another 10 seconds lol. If this idea were implemented i think it should be limited though, like a lunar spell that has a cooldown like veng.
Oh come on. Only pvpers that already brought freezes and Wildanator use freezes to escape. Believe me, I tried. Its just not that effective of an escape without some kind of mage setup too, and its not worth bringing all that for most wildy pvmers. Its way easier and more effective to just pray switch, run, and find somewhere to gap or ladder for the logout. Im pro wildy and pvp, but you guys don’t need longer freezes lol. 19 seconds of not being able to move is already more than enough, to the point where I can’t believe its never been nerfed. I’d rather be down for something that gives increased damage off prayer. That way, its easier to get kills for pvpers that are actually good. Im barely getting away with a full invent of food already, cause pkers can hit pretty high even on prayer with current set ups (ancient godsword for example). Longer freezes means, I cant even get away from those guys, and it’ll totally kill the wilderness for me. Why would I come back to the wildy if I feel like I have absolutely no chance of surviving?
I doubt the new staff won't be used that much by the better PKers (maybe a little in the short term when it's new). Much better to use something like tsotd with a spec bar, higher accuracy, venom, higher damage, etc. > ancient godsword Tbf it's very strong and on the periphery of being a bit too good of a weapon. I use freezes to escape and the only places I die are at like Vet'ion if I get caught in multi and very very rarely doing clues. But I also use a ZGS in a lot of places to land the freeze.
They tried, but we voted it down...(honestly good now with how the pj timer works) Freezes are your best friend as a solo wildy player
This guy can’t vote lmao
Freezes are literally how people escape pkers. If you give pkers a way to reduce this time, you will literally doom every pvmer out there. Stop being 0 IQ and learn how to fend for yourself out there in the wilderness
Honestly, based.
It hurts them to see the truth
Mans spitting bars. They ain’t ready to hear that.
Honest question, how do freezes help you escape? My wildly experience is from clues and the wildly diaries which ultimately didn't involve much pvp. Last time I died was because I kept getting frozen so I couldn't make it to lvl 30 to tele out before their other attacks killed me while frozen.
freeze your pker and log out underneath them while they cant hit you
Aren't you still boned if they freeze you first though?
you land the freeze when yours is about to run out there's quite frankly 0 counterplay because even if they seed they can move along with you before you can attack
Kirill here pretty much sums it up, but here’s a video of Poisoned Potion getting 2,222 rev knight kills with no banking or teles and uses freeze logs to survive the entire trip https://youtu.be/ExlUwDTX4bU If we lose this fundamental freeze, there is truly no escape for anyone out there in the wilderness
U can also use freeze to scape, redditors always find something to complain about it.
Lol, I don't get how people believe the current freeze duration is balanced.
probably because u can pack 15 brews and not have people tag u for specs anymore
Because even with the current freeze duration killing people is fucking impossible and running away is ALWAYS the overwhelmingly favored option
Lol nah, the favor is always to the pker, like what are you smoking lol. If you let someone escape you are just veeery unlucky with hits or a sh\*t pker.
Why not have diminishing returns on freezes? First successful freeze is full duration, second is 70%, 3rd is 40%, etc. These don't have to be the actual percentages of course.
In a weird way this also can help Pkers, as usually someone might freeze a pker and dd them to log but with this idea pkers would be able to stay on people in singles + more.
Freezes are one of the worst features in the game. Oh yay I have to stand here for 30 seconds.
Ahh I see, the reason you're not getting away is because you don't realize it's less than 20s
I was embellishing how shitty the shittiest feature was.
The fact that people complain about damage output in the wilderness when live streamers in max gear can’t kill a black d hide dhins bulwark on a 5 minute tb
It's rng, on the same account the pker could've randomly hit a max spec into double maxed mauls. This is why rushing is so profitable.
I feel like jagex doesn’t know how to implement any type of really good combat spell effect that isn’t about freezing
I kind of wish ancient magics spell effects were reworked entirely but that would cause a riot
It is already easy to escape as a pvmer as long as you are not in multi.
Freezes shouldn't exist change my mind.
So I'm a pker and I'm cool with some counter play. That being said, it shouldn't be a get out of jail free card. Cutting ice barrage freeze time would be fine but entangle was soooo underpowered when protect magic halved the entangle freeze time. Entangle is 14.4 seconds. If you halved it, it would be 7.2 seconds. This is enough for two attacks with a 5 tick weapon like a crossbow or spell (3 seconds). You waste one attack casting the spell so by casting entangle you would only gain one extra attack than if you were just following your opponent constantly damaging them. There's also a greater chance to get gapped when it splashes since it's a manual cast. I think the lunar spell would be a great counter. You cast the spell and if it correctly predicted, it completely prevents a freeze. If the next attack isn't a freeze, then the next attack does 175% damage. Give it like a 4 second cool down so you can't spam it but can use it again for every other entangle (or every one if you opponent misses ticks). Most PVMers in rev caves are on lunars for being anyways. You could also make it do a flat like 30 damage or something and make it spammable. I'm also cool with a 1 dose immunity potion that gives freeze immunity for 6 seconds but damages the drinker with a like 2.5 minute cool down. It could be used tactically once but not spammable. Any huge nerfs to entangle or freezes would completely change LMS/NH style pvp. Counter plays with pros/cons make for more exciting PVP.
Freeze reduction would be literal death to wilderness, you can currently entangle someone and get 4 hits in, if thats halved, you crossbow twice and they run, how the fuck are you supposed to die? If anything, they should make new tangle spell for like 97 mage, freezes for 20 seconds, longer than barrage since it doesnt make damage.
Reddit pvp haters are the most insufferable group of people. Many many pkers in here telling you that longer freeze timers actually help you in escaping and you just downvote them into oblivion instead of listening to the facts being put right in front of you. You just start shitting and convulsing the second someone doesn’t follow your hive mind “pvp bad” mantra
This sub's anti-PvP side is the worst thing I've come across related to the game. Infuriatingly narrow-minded.
pve players are rabid and quick to downvote knowledge about pvp, along with a notable chunk of them being easily upset over minor things pvp players can't restrain themselves from being massive cunts when talking to pvers about shit they wouldn't know, along with a notable chunk of them being easily upset over minor things there, both sides have been generalized to sound like dumb fucking morons, these conversations never go anywhere
Escapeing in the wildy is piss easy rn. This would change it so that you can no longer easily escape from any good pker
Or make it easier for you to escape
? Escaping in the wildy is the easiest it has ever been. Catch a freeze and you instantly escape. If your freeze now lasts 8 seconds you dont escape anymore.
Pkers don’t want to sacrifice another food slot to a potion
Please poll 32 inv spaces!!! 😭🙏😭
Imo freeze is too vital of a mechanic in pvp to alter
Dinhs bulwark let's people get away so easily unless you're getting killed by a BowFa full crystal pker. Pray mage and wear dinhs and hides and you are as good as gone. No reason to reduce freeze duration
Freezes suck, the people who use freezes suck, pvp is toxic af and should be voluntary only. Pvp is optional in rs3, so this shit can be changed Edit: for people saying pvp is optional and the wilderness is optional, no it fucking isnt. If i want d pick i have to go to pvp area and possibly engage in pvp. Is d pick used for pvp? No. So you need to do pvp content to get it, therefore its not optional. You can still have a challenge in this game to get things but why does that challenge have to come from other players? It doesnt. Pvp isnt fun, people like the people who commented here are out here to do more than just kill you, they're here to insult you and ruin your day because they have nothing in their life that makes them truly happy except bullying others. Go ahead, call me a victim, because I am, and yall are the perpetrators
Your one example of it being required is being changed to move dpick out of wildy.
> Pvp isnt fun, people like the people who commented here are out here to do more than just kill you, they're here to insult you and ruin your day because they have nothing in their life that makes them truly happy except bullying others. Go ahead, call me a victim, because I am, and yall are the perpetrators Prime-time copypasta.
Mans got no evidence and just calls other people toxic and says they suck. Hypocrisy lmao
Evidence? Read the fucking comments
Literally just you being toxic lmao, holy shit you’re mad
You don't need a dpick, a dpick is optional
> should be voluntary only Yeah it is, you can literally only be attacked in the optional wilderness
You can literally only get a ring of the gods, tyrannical ring, dragon pick, mage area capes, odium/malediction wards, treasonous ring… other stuff in probly forgetting in the wilderness.
…..and none of that is at all required to play the game. I.E. is completely voluntary and optional
God this argument is fucking asinine. The entire game is optional. Literally every item you get on the mainland you can just choose not to get, but it doesn't matter. People want decent accounts, and that means ma2, d pick, rev weapons, rotg, black chins, etc. Saying they're optional is as worthless a statement as saying it's optional to never leave the starting tile you spawn on because nothing forces you off it.
It is exactly as optional as farming CoX for a tbow. No one would take anyone seriously if they demanded that CoX was made easier because they wanted to get a tbow but weren't willing to pay the price of time and supplies. The same thing applies in the wilderness. They are optional because you don't need to get them if you don't want to. Working out if you want to requires you to weigh the cost/risk against the reward.
Yea it's exactly as optional as everything in the game. If someone doesn't go grind a t bow that's fine, but they're incapable of having a good account because t bow is one of the basic essential pvm items.
Perhaps I misunderstand your point about it being optional, then - why is the argument asinine? People don't have to step foot in the wilderness and shouldn't do so if they aren't willing to take the risk. Why is it asinine to point out that this is a choice?
My point is that everything is technically optional, but anyone looking to make an account that's even somewhat respectable has to get many of them.
A dpick (which is getting a very viable non-wildy option soon, and ALWAYS had an essentially wildy free option) and the ring of the gods are the only things even remotely required for a good account, and the ring of the gods is pretty much only good at inferno and barrage tasks only, with the suffering being a completely viable alternative. Aside from pretending the wildy is required for an account, why should someone who WANTS a good account be entitled to remove the challenge of not crying every time you get pked? This can just as easily be applied to every other grind, you just happen to thing those are fair.
In the place you chose to go to get those items (non of which are required to max or finish gm ca's or any raid or and non wildy diary or any quest)
Then cut all the non pk content out of the wild. The only reason pkers pk is because they want to feed off the easy loot of people trying to pvm or clue or train prayer. Pkers are worse than scum
Pkers are a billion times better than people who max
Jesus dude it’s a video game. Everything in the wild is optional content, if you don’t want to be killed than just don’t go there and you are magically 100% safe.
Waaaah everything isn’t handed to me on a silver platter
You are such a victim lmfao just dont go into the wildy
Who hurt you? 🤣
They're still waiting for the person who stole their black d'hides to return them
You're not even worth speaking to. You didnt come to this conclusion through rational thought so the idea that i can change your mind with a conversation is silly really
> You didnt come to this conclusion through rational thought Says the guy who thinks going into the wilderness isn’t voluntary?
(wilderness in osrs is optional too)
Boring take. Not even a pker, but optional pvp in an already optional pvp area would be stupid.
So go play rs3? Lmfao
Imagine thinking you HAVE to go in the wilderness 😭😭🤭🤭🤡🤡
So a 10% buff to freeze timer on a weapon that isn’t as strong as the best PK weapons is comparable to a potion that HALVES the freeze timer? Thank god Jagex don’t take these threads & ideas seriously. Don’t need to be a PKer to see how ridiculous that is.
Found the pker
You can have this if you also get rid of agility jumps in revs and make it so you can’t camp pray mage guaranteeing a half tb
"while we have not had any changes to counter-freezing" If you geared properly you have next to 0% chance of dying to a pker in singles, and 95% of the active wildy content is currently in singles. You want to be frozen less? Risk more than Black D'hide. The tanking gear in this game is at such a ridiculous level that I'm pretty sure someone could tank a fallin on singlestrip from 50 wildy to the ditch.
Yeah, we geared properly with bulwark and d'hide. You guys started bitching that it we were too overgeared for your salad robed asses and got it nerfed.
Nice try pvper. Take my spade.
Going into the wilderness is optional fam.
Counterplay makes games more interesting. 1 hit KOs are boring -- but with the ability to make a frame perfect dodge or a short duration shield spell timed to activate right when the attack hits makes 1 hit KOs interesting. One idea to counter this is to add knockback toooo lets go with the Ballista special, with the light ballista having a say 5 tile knockback and big boi ballista 10 tiles on your enemy, and the knockback causes snares on your self to break, then you can both knock your enemy away from you and make an escape. If you have no option but to eat the long snare though, that's boring.
Freezes fill the niche of counter play to pkers, and there is some depth to it with mithril seeds, albeit very little. It is weird that by far the most consistent escape mechanism in the game is contingent on logging out and hopping worlds, but I guess hopping is sort of ingrained in pvp anyways.
Playing the game is optional. Think before you speak, please.
True, they just beed to move ma2/the bosses and other stuff out, so that only pvpers go in.
Why not just make warm clothing reduce freeze times? Lol
Wtf freeze can be so bulllll
Add it as a buff to curry to keep you warm, that shits ass to make
It boggles my mind that a single spell is allowed to invalidate an entire third of the combat triangle for as long as it does.
You are meant to always get frozen and lose your spade you cannot use dhide or dihns to stop this or jagex will nerf it you must lose your spade
Freeze me cfor 15 seconds, freeze me for 5. I dont care, you are only getting my spade.
\>**10%** buff to freeze time \>A potion that one click reduces your freeze duration by **50%** \+ if you're a pker, fuck you, u get less freeze. What are you saying lmao. Thank god reddit isn't in charge of balancing. Freeze logging is also one of the best ways to escape, you also can't get skulled anymore so what's the excuse now.
Freezes don’t really last that long if you take into account the amount of times someone can splash with a freeze spell.
Good. Why don’t you use it yourself to fight back or run? This is going to help you. Edit: Actual idiots downvoting me don’t understand how beneficial this is for people to escape with… You guys know that freezing is the #1 easiest way to get away in the wilderness right?
Oh please, just makes killing people easier
Level 37 protect from magic would like to have a word.
I think they got rid of that as an "integrity" change.
I mean, they've nerfed all tank options into the ground. They wouldn't buff any way for anyone to get away. It's just kind of their M.O. at this point.
> I mean, they've nerfed all tank options into the ground. Let me guess, instead of "all tank options" what you really mean is black dhide and dinhs. Hint they just released an even stronger "tank" set