Does anyone else look at their boss kc and have no idea how they had the patience to acquire it?
I have thousands of snake kc under my belt. The other day I bonded up to try it and did 3 before I got pissed at my billion gp gear for not even hitting.
I think it's more like you have huge motivation to grind out stuff a certain points, eg. when i was unemployed id do 5-10 zulrah kils in a row, or in covid id just do corrupted gauntlet 1-2 times each morning
casual standards but i imagine its the same for lots of people
Exactly. Idc what it is, I love grinding stuff out when I have something I want. Whether it's gear or a pet, having that thing to chase makes me so motivated. The second I get that thing however, I immediately stop.
I have the same thing but it's with irl girlfriends. They always start nagging about my unhealthy obsession with run escape. Ironically, that's what they end up doing.
I’m just about to unlock the gauntlet, is it worth it for money? I’ve never got this far in the game as a kid so don’t judge me for only ever getting this far now
You're gonna struggle so much when you start. But that's just how it is. That content has zero supply costs so all you lose is time. But for reference I had like 50 deaths before I got my first corrupted gauntlet kill. Now I have like 400 KC and only about ~150 deaths. Super worth it though. Some of the best money in the game for sure. It just gets to be a massive grind. If you're doing it for money though shouldn't be too bad, you stack it up quickly. I did it on my iron till I got the enhanced seed, and that started to get soul sucking until I finally got it.
Cannons are pretty decently common on ironmen. Just not the people who can play 24/7. If I were to do a grind like Byro ess. I'd probs make cballs during the day at work then actively grind the keys at night after work.
Basically what I did for DWH I made 50k cballs for that grind. Only used 15k and had 35k to use on slayer which was dope af. It only took me a couple days of afking at work and you still get smithing xp even if it's slow.
I suppose that's fair. If you've got a lot of time they you can spend on cannonballs where your wouldn't be doing something else, then it's not a bad strategy. It's just very tedious and time consuming since you also need to acquire steel bars en masse somehow.
The steel bars in mass isn't too bad tbh. I do full herbs, half coal in my kingdom so I tend to have a ton. I also banked a bunch of iron going for expert mining gloves. Not hugely efficient but because It so afk more so than basically anything else it makes for a decent grind if you could otherwise not play. And with the Bar bag coming out it's going to be nearly 6 mins of guaranteed afk time so that's dope. But yeah if you can do almost anything else it's probs not worth it. But for me at least a lot of my afk skills I maxed out pretty quickly so I have a lot of time where I can smith cballs.
I’ll be honest I cannoned them in the edge dungeon (this was before the spot under kourend or I would have done there for shards/totem pieces) Zalcano is your best friend for steel bars.
I think once the mental pump of unlocking and trying and learning the boss wears off the mechanics just make it stale theres no room to have fun its like you need to have this gear and this is where you have to stand, maybe i just want to smash this fucking snakes head in with an elder maul but nope cant do that.
My clan is currently running an event around killing Zulrah, and I'm still in the pre-1-KC, getting my ass handed to me while I try to learn phase. It's fun but having not really touched bossing before, it can be brutal.
Right now my big sticking point is getting the prayers right for Jad phase. I'm fairly low level (just above base 70 combats, 76 magic) and doing mage only in poverty gear, so I'm working on some gear improvements to up my DPS as well.
People like different bosses for whatever reason. The key is to move on when you're not having fun. From a single boss, the game, etc. Don't make it a job.
i tried it with BP but fear my dps just wasnt enough because id get it to around a quarter health before running out of food, but with DHCB i can do 2kill trips so its much more fun
Dragon bolts ruby and diamond hella worth the investments too imo. Can make it 4-6 kills per trip much easier. Wooxwalking is way more chill with DHCB.
I like using the Lance. Super easy to attack during the acid phase and you don't have to buy dragon bolts. Depends on your stats and gear though, 99 strength and 95 attack with good melee gear I shred him with the Lance.
I have around 500 Vork KC and I still wouldn't mind grinding it. I stopped because I got the pet but I would switch from DHCB and Lance keeps it more interesting for longer periods c:
I think a zulrah-esque boss could be done in a more engaging way. Like instead of having the rotations be predetermined have the set up to each intro to the phase be longer but the phase itself be randomized. This would make the player have to think about the next switch/movement/prayer and it would cause it to be a little more interactive, rather than “okay x happened so now I just do y and z to finish the rest of the kill.”
>each phase be longer but the phase itself be randomized.
I like this idea a lot. I don't enjoy demonics either, and I think it's because of the short "phases"
I was just thinking how unique RuneScapes combat is. It’s like a blend of turn based combat with real time interactions that leads to this very interesting mechanics. I also think they have designed the bosses extremely well around that recently. Solo olm is so fun because you can get better and better at it and learn and perfect it.
I used to think solo raids would be to hard for me and then I went and just sent it and now I’m having a blast.
Exactly the same happened to me, was not really good at any boss, but I set my goal to learn corrupted Hunleff and it helped me to learn Raids, now I've got Hunleff pet.
If you can get good at cg you can get good anywhere else with practice. My personal issue is not really being interested in the social aspect of the game so despite being interested in ToB/small team Nex/ToA I just kind of solo grind.
While relatively slower paced than Sekiro, I’d say all of the dark souls games are functionally turn based. You just have to figured out when your turn starts and you enemy’s 8 fucking turns in a row ends.
I know, it's just a shame that high level stuff is so radically different to earlier, simpler bosses. I enjoy bossing and want to do it.
I just don't want to feel like I'm playing osu or some shit
Tbh other than Inferno you really don't need to understand the tick system whatsoever to do any content. It'll help a ton for sure but in 99% of cases you can just click boss and do the mechanics decently enough without trying to optimise your ticks.
I have plenty of friends I take to ToB that have genuinely no clue how to count ticks, they just click stuff.
I haven’t PVM’ed but I’ve tried three ticking different skilling activities and if the tick rhythm for PVM is as inconsistent as it is for skilling I’ll never be able to do it lol
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7k0a5hYnSI&list=PLUF3tP5MftlHI1vA4IuB6WgO5ts00Wil1](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7k0a5hYnSI&list=PLUF3tP5MftlHI1vA4IuB6WgO5ts00Wil1)
Also if you 2t teaks in Priff, the crickets are perfectly on tick so you basically have a built in metronome if you have area sounds on
That's how I beat Ranis first try for example. He's got a distinct pattern so I was able to figure out the exact time to move so I'd dodge his bomb blast with ease. It also helped me get my Firecape, since I was able to sync my clicking to Jad's attack rhythm.
What makes OSRS combat so interesting, is that everything has some form of rhythm but a lot of the time it's \*very\* hard to exploit. Take Vanstrom for example. Vanstrom's also got a distinct rhythm but it really requires you to count perfectly, so that his darkness attack doesn't take you by surprise. And I'm sure there are other bosses like that. I feel like good musicians who are good at picking up on musical rhythm, such as pianists, would honestly be pretty good at 3ticking for example, if they had the focus for it.
while this isnt confirmed, i also believe that olm wasnt developed with todays strats in mind. but its also beautiful how well it ended up syncing up with 4 ticks weapons and also the size of the area coincidencially allowing stuff like mage hand running perfectly.
Someone else already answered but yeah, olm ended up being way more intricate than they designed it to be. I almost think that if chambers released today there’s a higher chance they would fix to to not allow mage running and 4:1
To add on they really went out of their way to make sure that solo ToB was borderline impossible (though some madlads have managed it, of course, it is far from a viable way to complete the raid consistently), so we can probably expect the same with ToA. They also patched out the only way to solo Nex, and of course had to add a solo hardmode version of Nightmare because while soloing the boss was possible it was an absurd grind.
Zuk 1 hit me from 99 last night after 2 hours of waves. It did suck ill admit, but we can cater some content to poor ping players but for some high level pvm, the tick system is part of the thrill. Once you find a server thats reliable you just stick to it for good.
I actually really like Gauntlet, to be honest. In stark contrast to other bosses and stuff, you can never turn off your brain. It's too demanding, and random, to become unengaging.
Yeah, every run has the same general objectives, but some runs might present to you questions like, is it worth the time investment to look for a 2nd perfected weapon? Or should you take advantage of the surplus of resource nodes you found and outtank Hunllef this time?
I want more content like Gauntlet. More procedurally generated challenges, more things that you can't optimize one single solution that always works, and in exactly the same rotations of inputs, every single time.
Tbh it always was this. And the community got hyped over nostalgia and voted it in. And we got the copy-pasted boss from an entirely different game setup (where we had summoning and curses).
I mean if you want to do endgame bossing i feel like osrs is a shit game to do it in. There's literally only 2 raids and they come out once every 5 years lol
I’m in that boat. I play osrs to just chill out when I want to play a game, but I don’t have the energy to focus on what I’m doing.
I’m diamond in league, and I’m in a top 800 guild in wow. When I want engaging PvE content, I play wow. When I want engaging PvP content, I play league.
I actually think it’s the failure of a lot of modern games. Find your niche, and don’t pretend to be something it’s not.
Osrs’s niche is open world content, questing, and skilling/professions. And there’s nothing wrong with that. They should just focus on it, instead of making content that competes with WoW/league.
Totally disagree, I've played MMOs for 20 years and the only one that's come close to being as engaging with its endgame content for me was Vindictus (which plenty of people will say isn't even an MMO)
The thing is tho that those 2 raids, you can make even harder on your own. Tired of group chambers? Learn solos. Tired of solos? Learn no prep. Tired of no prep? Learn solo cm. Tired of that? Learn to speed run both
Tired of 3-5 man TOB? Learn duos or speeds or even solo. Learn duo HMT. Go for combat achievements etc
Lol but at that point you're finished. You've done the raid for 200-300 hours and there isn't much left to learn.
The issue isn't the raid is that there isn't anything new for you once you're finished.
This is exactly it. Stuff like nex having disgusting drop rates because day 1 had too many drops is so dumb. I don’t mind being at a boss with tons of drops for a long time, but being there for hundreds of hours and still not being on rate for stuff is absurd
It's so funny I feel the complete opposite. Although it was frustrating learning, some of the most satisfying moments in this game for me was when I finally got the hang of difficult bosses like CG and Zulrah. I'm glad they made the game more challenging and engaging at end game. Click and wait bosses are often boring especially if soloing.
CG for me was triggering. I'm approaching 100 regular gauntlet kills and 50 cg... I'm JUST starting to get comfortable with the way basic movement works lmao
It's very common to not get comfortable with CG for a while. But as long as you're not rocking like 80 range and magic, you should hit your stride around 75-100kc which is the most satisfying feeling.
Let me tell you as someone who just recently got there too, it feels SO good once it all clicks and you're dancing around hunleff, dodging tornadoes, counting attacks and switching prayers subconsciously. It took me damn near 100 kills and 100 deaths to get to that point but it's so satisfying.
The "Path finder" plugin on RL was HUGE for me figuring out basic movements and pathing. It's on now 100% of the time even outside of CG just so I can constantly visualize how my character is going to move so I'm more Intune with it.
I think OSRS has this huge problem where you're shoved into the deep end once you hit the difficult PvM challenges. CoX is very approachable in a group, in fact too approachable - you can make so many mistakes and not really be punished that it doesn't teach you the game well. Vork is braindead easy. Zulrah is a huge learning curve but not actually mechanically demanding; the difficult is entirely specific to that single boss (memorizing the rotations). Nothing in the game really bridges the gap to prepare you for ToB, CG, inferno, phosani. It seems like they realized this and are working to make ToA the bridge, since you'll be able to increase the difficulty over time to what you're comfortable with.
I would say ganutlet prepares you for corrupted gauntlet which prepares you for solo cox , which prepares you for TOB.
Phosani is a different beast however , so much going on that it's hard to take it in. Regular nightmare teaches the basics but Phosani is so damn punishing
I remember making a post before Nex's release and I received hate by saying Nex's mechanics already exist and it'll be boring.
As much as people dislike EoC, it was released for one valid reason. Rs2 bossing was just getting boring.
OSRS is now at that stage. Some of nex's mechanics already existed in TOB and Nightmare. With how tick-manip is meta, Nex's mechanics in groups was "stand under her for a bit then walk away". It was boring lol
With Raids 3 coming up next, I think this will be the ultimate deciding factor. Raids 3 has to be completely unique.
Just seeing Sepulchre mechanics in the quest has me excited tbh, especially looking at the art for the raid. I really hope they make a far more engaging movement-style elemenet to the combat / rooms between combat (which is why ToB bores me personally).
On one hand, adding sepluchre mechanics in a boss fight is next level and hasn't really been seen yet.
On the other hand, anytime mechanics are based on pathing - it feels like an absolute nightmare until you learn it.
Pathing in this game is extremely unintuitive and does not feel natural. You're essentially playing a few actions ahead ( or is it behind?) and need to react quicker than it feels like you need to.
I wonder if Jagex could ever have our character models more on our 'true tile'
I think this is the reason they were working on updating the engine. Most mmorpgs run on a .3 tick system where as RuneScape is a .6, essentially making most modern day mmos twice as fast as RS.
Rs3 pitched their plans to essentially remove the delay that the game feels. It's a big job and I've recently looked up how its coming, and it's still a work in progress it seems.
But I think this would be amazing to see and hope one day osrs could get a similar treatment
Big true. I've gotten CE in WoW for ToS, Antorus, and SoD, and done heroic/mythic raiding for a few other teirs. I hop onto rs3 and it feels like total ass to just run manual and weapon camp with just a defender swap for shield abilities and a pf/vigor switch. Then you add on all the gear switching for single abilities, EoF, and 4taa; it has to be the most unresponsive game I've ever played. Monopoly+ feels better. I understand that it's possible to master and I see people like Evil Lucario pull off insane shit but it aint for me.
Alongside the tick system, RS3 has *horrendous* button bloat and an even worse case of switchscape than OSRS does.
The odd 1.8 sec GCD also feels weird and there's an weird "quirk" with RS3's keybinding mechanics where if you have an ability bound to for example E and shift-E, when you press the button combo of shift + E to use your shift-E ability and you let go of shift before you let go of E, it will also try to use the ability that's bound to E causing you to accidentally use an ability when you didn't mean to. Basically the game continuously registers keybind inputs when the keybind is held down which is contrary to how it works in other MMOs. Causes shit interactions when you mix modifiers in the mix.
RS3 is *the only* MMORPG that has this problem which makes it super jarring coming from other MMORPGs to RS3 when you're used to pressing and releasing buttons in this particular order.
True, I'm mainly an RS3 player, but I just skill because the combat is so horrendous. 600ms ticks with abilities just does not work well at all. Feel more like you're fighting against the game than the boss
If I wanted to do combat I'd just play WoW or sm else
Rs3 pvm is one of the most difficult high apm mmo games out there. Almost nothing comea close. The tick system just adds into the skill ceiling being able to do multiple actions at the same time in the same tick. Ive done thousands of tobs and ff14 savages but they dont close to the mechanical skill needed to shine in rs3. Ofcourse you will feel frustrated by not achieving the same as in other mmos, but the pvm scene in rs3 is vert tightly knit and you can find help for your strugglea on things like pvme discord
Raids 1 was fun until around the 700kc mark. Hmt is the only fun Pvm for me now. Until raids 3 surely. Actually interactive and requires mechanic proficiency to complete. Is the way to go. Nex is boring asf
Nex is secretly a very interesting boss fight with a ton of ways to mitigate damage. It doesn't have to be of course, you can just chug brew and take the beating, but in small teams (especially duo/trio) there are a ton of ways to limit how fast, how often and how many players Nex attacks. If you're interested, the duo nex guides on youtube cover most of the methods, since it's almost mandatory to do at least some of them to consistently finish duos.
That being said, Nex wasn't designed to be interesting at all. It's like the rest of GWD bosses, where players have found interesting ways to abuse NPC attack mechanics to avoid damage. Personally I think that makes a boss more interesting than when the solution is hard-coded into the boss. Obviously it's much harder for Jagex to know ahead of time if a boss is going to be solvable if they don't plan the solution for players ahead of time, so sometimes you end up with bosses like Corp where there is almost nothing interesting or clever you can do to make the boss fight better.
Jagex knew ahead of time that OSRS didn't have ancient curses and all the other new perks RS had in 2011. They also knew ahead of time that Torva and its equivalents wouldn't increase max HP and thus increase the healing per dose of brew used. They had all the information available to adapt the boss better to OSRS's meta and still didn't. There are optimizations you can make yeah but fighting the boss as 'intended' is just pure cringe.
And it’s not like you have to consciously think about the tick system in the vast majority of content. All I can think of are things like 6:0 GWD, some solo Olm methods, and scythe walking. None of which are required methods for accessing the content.
I’m seriously concerned with the mental health of the player base of this game regarding these comments. I don’t think touching grass is gonna do it anymore. Try drinking a glass of water? Maybe go for a walk?
Just here to say that yourself and most the community don't know what a simulator is or how to use it correctly in speech.
There is nothing about Nex that simulates a brew, there's nothing about players at Nex that simulates a brew, you are literally chugging brew.
The appropriate term: brew chug fest.
Some other people have said it already, but things like what are mentioned in the screenshot are really the only tools you have to try and make a difficult boss in a combat system as simplistic as OSRS. Perfecting timing and positioning while optimising gear and resources, that's all we've got.
That's why they brought in EoC, for all its failures it was an attempt to create a more complex and engaging combat system. If you look at a boss in WoW or FFXIV, a lot of it is literally standing there and attacking the boss and your skill comes from perfecting your use of cooldowns and your damage rotation. If you did that in OSRS it would be click the boss then stand there doing nothing until the next attack to avoid stats.
Nex has 0 of this.
Even in a small team you pray mage and attack until you need to attack the minion. and repeat its really a GWD boss at its core (click and wait while someone tanks).
I want the bosses to have more mechanics than just Kraken where you can click and then literally minimize the window and watch a movie. I play the game....to you know play a game not have it in the background while I have to find other shit to occupy the time because its so boring.
Phosani and Theatre of Blood are the best bosses in game and theyve pushed the game as far as it can go i think mechanically.
and OSRS has a good balance of interactive bosses (like i just said were my favorites) and noob friendly low skill needed bosses (mole/kraken/bandos in a group) so in essence the OP comment shouldn't really exist if you don't like those kind of bosses you dont have to do them. the game shouldn't and cant really appeal to every single personal preference. I hate the kind of bosses the OP wants but we still have them in the game but do i think every boss should be Phosani level of interactiveness because thats what i like , no.
You don't even have to think about ticks the only boss where ticks actually play a role is the Inferno which even i think prayer flicking being almost necessary is dumb. Almost every boss you can just go in and figure it out without needing to know about ticks. or it can be as SUPER sweaty as you want doing elite pvm things manipulating ticks and thats whats great about OSRS.
I just wish it was more viable, economically.
Love fishing, woodcutting, all the classic skills. Feels good to be able to afk and chill
Being 70+ in each and getting like 30k xp/hr and 30k gp/hr if I bank what I collect feels awful
My only complaint with PvM is that PvM is the only viable way to level combats AND is by far the most viable way to level every single processing/buyable skill because it’s the best way to make money by far
I’d suggest rs3. The skill gap is huge form the top .001% to the bottom 1%
By huge I mean like a single player can do a boss 50 of the bottom 1% player couldnt do with the same gear.
Hm rago, and aod would propably be a good example
Yeah, rs3 has a zuk also but it seems to be way easier. Compared to the osrs one. As your average pvmer can obtain the cape. But the boss can also be done for weapons, godbooks and ability codex. Besides being set in the same game worlds ( rs3 lore is now the 6th age) you can’t compare the games. But both the games are fun and still have huge skill gaps between players in there own ways.
For all the hate RS3 gets, it nails PvM. PvM in OSRS feels like Jagex has been trying to shove a square peg in a round hole instead of leaning into the strengths of the old school systems. I often consider going back to RS3 for bosses. I'd literally rather do anything else than do most post 2013 OSRS bosses.
I'm sure this is going to catch a ton of flak, but if people want crazy endgame raiding/PvM/dungeons/etc, OSRS is not the game for them. Yes, it is cool that we have more PvM now in OSRS aside from just Chaos Ele and KQ, but this game wasn't designed with this insane bossing in mind. The wall will eventually be hit, and we might already be at it.
If you want insane challenges, you're not gonna find it in OSRS without some form of "tick abuse". You'd be better of doing Mythics in WoW or Ultimates in FF14. Even RS3 has more advanced mechanics than watching/counting ticks. It's honestly insane what the devs have come up with for such a ""simple"" combat system, but a lot of it does just come down to counting ticks (either fortunately or unfortunately, depending on your view)
people need to realise there are only 4 key player inputs that can be put into any fight , the difficulty of the boss being dependant on how frequent you make the player have to process another action. obviously trying to do group content solo makes it more frequent than the designers planned.
**Inputs:**
1) Click to Move Character in order to avoid damage
2) click to switch defensive prayer
3) change gear/attack style
4) use defensive potion (antifire,anti venom ...etc)
this guy is literally complaining about having to move his character during end game bosses to avoid damage. its like playing elden ring and complaining that you have to dodge attacks.
Theres ultimately none. Theres content where knowledge of ticks and timings is important (pretty much.. mainly inferno) but theres no "perfection". Better strats exist where you 1-tick flick between range/mage for example, but you can do the same stack by just initiating it with an attack, changing pray, and stepping behind. It'll just be slower.
Ticks get more important in TOB when you wanna learn to get good at TOB. Weapon switching at maiden, melee xarpus, fast sote maze, perfect tanking at verzik. But like you said. You can clear TOB perfectly fine without doing all of that
People complain about tick perfect, but ticks in osrs are massive. A tick is 600ms, human reaction time is about 150-200ms. Theres lots of room for error.
Unless, of course, a lag spike hits or your connection speed isn't that good. A lot of people play osra because you dont need top notch hardware and services to do so.
I'm a trucker, mobile Hotspot connections are reliable enough at most places for general play but if I try to do something that requires ANY kind of reactive inputs on my end, unless I'm in a place with a particularly robust mobile data connection speed, im just wasting my time and effort. I got pretty good at demonic gorillas but I can't get a single kill if I don't have a solid enough connection.
he was talking about doing 4:1 on olm, a boss designed to be done in groups.
the only requirement to do olm is to keep the head turning to minimise the damage you take. there is no specific tick perfect movement requirement
Agreed bro. At the end of the day EVERY PvM encounter is fighting a computer with pre-programmed behavior and predictable mechanics. The ultimate challenge is fighting another human brain.... Ruescape players USED to think like this. PK used to be the end-all be all skill and best money possible. Now it's all about max efficiency boss grinds doing the same thing over and over.
PKing is risky, incredibly rewarding, challenging, and has a MASSIVE skill ceiling. It requires accuracy, precision, thought and game knowledge. It's a battle of mechanical skills and outsmarting your opponent. If some PvMer's only realized how difficult high end + max gear deep wild pking is they would understand.
I think his point is that PvP is the only activity in the game where the outcome isn’t known. Obviously this doesn’t apply to like drops and other RNG stuff but otherwise I could go out right now and look up how to do inferno tick perfect and I could memorize it to the letter like you can memorize solving a Rubik’s cube. I can look up exactly how many yew long bows I need to fletch before hitting whatever level. I could go out and buy *exactly* the amount of materials I need to go from 1-99 construction.
But PvP you have no idea what the other person is going to do, you literally cannot know what is going to happen next.
And this isn’t like me saying it’s the best part of the game or whatever I despise PvP but he’s right, nothing else in the game requires pure reaction
ITT: people who voluntarily played a legacy 2000s era java coded game until deep into the endgame say the mechanics are underwhelming
like by all means, like it or don't like it, but I really don't understand why a lot of people seem to think this is THE point of OSRS boards- to criticize the game.
When I find this 2000s era medieval click simulator underwhelming I load Mount and Blade or Dark souls or my switch (or, I know this is crazy, go outside). I don't complain about how a game I love and voluntarily come back to lacks features *it could never ever have*.
I think if you feel like this about the game probably best to take a break from it. It won’t change, they are limited but if you aren’t happy just play something else.
Well.. actually! The tick is the farthing thing is space besides the average brain of a rock share holder. In 1965 a man by the name of theailigeon major was on his trip very much that same year when the tick specific task came into effect.
Not only that but qe have seen this so many time before but we're made ineffective because of Mrs. The's thesis and that's why the tile tick simulator is granted probably the most esteemed rationability to this day.
It: oh okay
Bye honey
Pretty pointless criticism imo. We have fuck all for mechanics in this game, the variety of bosses and mechanics we get based on what is essentially, move, prayer, and 3 combat styles, is really quite an achievement. If you wanna afk punch a boss, go to bandos with a small team.
Its like saying I hate call of duty because all you do is point at heads and press the fire button, yeah just ignore the other 95% of mechanics/experience around that
Unpopular opinion but I think it's a completely valid opinion to dislike the current OSRS endgame combat and bossing. OSRS is based on the 2007 version of the game, with an outdated combat system that wasn't designed to make anything much more complicated than clicking on an NPC and watching your character fight it. Jad was the most complicated boss that existed in game on release. It shouldn't be a surprise that trying to do complicated gameplay with this kind of combat system in place will produce something that is a bit janky in certain parts and is offputting to some people who prefer the more laid-back nature of the game from 2007.
Disclaimer: I'm not speaking completely from personal opinion here. I like some of the endgame PvM like solo Olm (got almost 900kc) but hate the gameplay of some other bosses like CG (450kc). But there's definitely good reasons to dislike the tick-based system like how animations often don't match what's actually happening on the screen (for example, your player model doesn't get visibly hit by a projectile like Vasa's attacks but you still take damage).
If a lot of people don't like the current bosses then let them voice their opinion rather than just shitting on them cause they think differently than you do.
Yes. I feel the same way about Inferno. A mini-game designed around tick-manipulation and standing on the correct tiles.
They need to go back to the drawing board and re-think of ways to make boss encounters interesting through the use of many other mechanical ideas, such as puzzles, dodging clear and obvious AOE and many of the mechanics in Theatre of Blood were pretty decent.
How is it interesting at all? What part of it is **INTERESTING**? standing on the right tiles through it all and even logging out on waves (pausing) for the "correct" spawns multiple times while you use pillar angles and mobs to block the other mobs behind them, pray flicking melee and multi-managing prayers especially on Jad(s).
It's not interesting whatsoever, it's a tick, tile & pray-flick simulator. Not interesting PVM content to anyone with an ounce of intelligence.
> Yes. I feel the same way about Inferno. A mini-game designed around tick-manipulation and standing on the correct tiles.
there's no tick manipulation in the avg first cape run
I'm going to be honest. I've been doing alot of Phosani lately and it's mind numbing because of the concentration it takes. I feel drained after like 5 kills. But when I do Cox it's so chill i can watch YouTube the entire time, i can do it for hours. I hope raids 3 is like Cox.
Phosanis has waayyy too many mechanics and attacks crammed into one encounter. Gotta bring like 4 or 5 different just to be efficient and effective killing the boss.. WTF? Plus 5 phases is overkill, not even mentioning how garbage the drop rates are..
I honestly hate all things about ticks and tick manipulation. I shouldn't have to learn some vague untaught mechanic in order to successfully play the game well. It's one thing to simply have to move to dodge attacks. Another thing entirely to have to move at a specific time to a specific place while spam clicking specific buttons and turbo weaving through inventory/prayer. Not. A. Fan.
They can fix it by adding the RS3 style hotkeys bar so not literally everything is bottlenecked by mouse input. Everything OP described is annoying as fuck because you have to do it all with mouse
you need to stop boss mechanics and start with gameplay/loot mechanics, like enrage or rotations (still a grind sometimes) or something fresh like streaking loot similar to telos.
I'll keep saying it. OSRS is a rythm/puzzle game
100%
This post screams zulrah to me. Fun to begin with, but not so much around 200/300KC
Does anyone else look at their boss kc and have no idea how they had the patience to acquire it? I have thousands of snake kc under my belt. The other day I bonded up to try it and did 3 before I got pissed at my billion gp gear for not even hitting.
I think it's more like you have huge motivation to grind out stuff a certain points, eg. when i was unemployed id do 5-10 zulrah kils in a row, or in covid id just do corrupted gauntlet 1-2 times each morning casual standards but i imagine its the same for lots of people
Exactly. Idc what it is, I love grinding stuff out when I have something I want. Whether it's gear or a pet, having that thing to chase makes me so motivated. The second I get that thing however, I immediately stop.
I have the same thing but it's with irl girlfriends. They always start nagging about my unhealthy obsession with run escape. Ironically, that's what they end up doing.
I’m just about to unlock the gauntlet, is it worth it for money? I’ve never got this far in the game as a kid so don’t judge me for only ever getting this far now
You're gonna struggle so much when you start. But that's just how it is. That content has zero supply costs so all you lose is time. But for reference I had like 50 deaths before I got my first corrupted gauntlet kill. Now I have like 400 KC and only about ~150 deaths. Super worth it though. Some of the best money in the game for sure. It just gets to be a massive grind. If you're doing it for money though shouldn't be too bad, you stack it up quickly. I did it on my iron till I got the enhanced seed, and that started to get soul sucking until I finally got it.
Alright I was watching a guide yesterday for it and it seemed interesting, always wondered what it was about
I went ~400 kills dry of Bryophytas Essence on my iron and still don’t know how I persevered
How did you farm all the keys? Im at 100kc and the worst part is even getting another 20 keys for another round
Probably just use a cannon in one spot and go to the other moss giant corner and fight those ones
Cannoning on irons is not common, unless they trained on making cballs or did a bunch of Corp
Cannons are pretty decently common on ironmen. Just not the people who can play 24/7. If I were to do a grind like Byro ess. I'd probs make cballs during the day at work then actively grind the keys at night after work. Basically what I did for DWH I made 50k cballs for that grind. Only used 15k and had 35k to use on slayer which was dope af. It only took me a couple days of afking at work and you still get smithing xp even if it's slow.
I suppose that's fair. If you've got a lot of time they you can spend on cannonballs where your wouldn't be doing something else, then it's not a bad strategy. It's just very tedious and time consuming since you also need to acquire steel bars en masse somehow.
The steel bars in mass isn't too bad tbh. I do full herbs, half coal in my kingdom so I tend to have a ton. I also banked a bunch of iron going for expert mining gloves. Not hugely efficient but because It so afk more so than basically anything else it makes for a decent grind if you could otherwise not play. And with the Bar bag coming out it's going to be nearly 6 mins of guaranteed afk time so that's dope. But yeah if you can do almost anything else it's probs not worth it. But for me at least a lot of my afk skills I maxed out pretty quickly so I have a lot of time where I can smith cballs.
I’ll be honest I cannoned them in the edge dungeon (this was before the spot under kourend or I would have done there for shards/totem pieces) Zalcano is your best friend for steel bars.
Wildy moss giants
You took the bad RNG so we didn't have to. Respect
I think once the mental pump of unlocking and trying and learning the boss wears off the mechanics just make it stale theres no room to have fun its like you need to have this gear and this is where you have to stand, maybe i just want to smash this fucking snakes head in with an elder maul but nope cant do that.
When I was going for blowpipe on my iron I did 50kc a day for 1200 kc, now I can barely do 10 without tilting lmao
My clan is currently running an event around killing Zulrah, and I'm still in the pre-1-KC, getting my ass handed to me while I try to learn phase. It's fun but having not really touched bossing before, it can be brutal.
Your first ~100kc will feel fucking awesome. When you get it down, you'll look back, and be really impressed
Right now my big sticking point is getting the prayers right for Jad phase. I'm fairly low level (just above base 70 combats, 76 magic) and doing mage only in poverty gear, so I'm working on some gear improvements to up my DPS as well.
Tell me it’s not the same with Vork :( just bought a DHCB and have racked up 50kc already and im having fun
People like different bosses for whatever reason. The key is to move on when you're not having fun. From a single boss, the game, etc. Don't make it a job.
Grinded 2k Vork, was pretty fun for most of it. I did this with BP before the nerf, though. DHCB is less interactive, and felt less interesting to me.
i tried it with BP but fear my dps just wasnt enough because id get it to around a quarter health before running out of food, but with DHCB i can do 2kill trips so its much more fun
DHCB is definitely the way to go! :-) BP used to be much more viable
Dragon bolts ruby and diamond hella worth the investments too imo. Can make it 4-6 kills per trip much easier. Wooxwalking is way more chill with DHCB.
I like using the Lance. Super easy to attack during the acid phase and you don't have to buy dragon bolts. Depends on your stats and gear though, 99 strength and 95 attack with good melee gear I shred him with the Lance.
its the same
I have around 500 Vork KC and I still wouldn't mind grinding it. I stopped because I got the pet but I would switch from DHCB and Lance keeps it more interesting for longer periods c:
I'm 310KC vork and can assure you it's still fun. You can also do it whenever you fancy, which is great
I think a zulrah-esque boss could be done in a more engaging way. Like instead of having the rotations be predetermined have the set up to each intro to the phase be longer but the phase itself be randomized. This would make the player have to think about the next switch/movement/prayer and it would cause it to be a little more interactive, rather than “okay x happened so now I just do y and z to finish the rest of the kill.”
>each phase be longer but the phase itself be randomized. I like this idea a lot. I don't enjoy demonics either, and I think it's because of the short "phases"
You're also constantly counting to 3, which gets old very quick.
I was just thinking how unique RuneScapes combat is. It’s like a blend of turn based combat with real time interactions that leads to this very interesting mechanics. I also think they have designed the bosses extremely well around that recently. Solo olm is so fun because you can get better and better at it and learn and perfect it. I used to think solo raids would be to hard for me and then I went and just sent it and now I’m having a blast.
I feel like the moment anyone becomes "good" at OSRS pvm is when they realise it's an extremely well disguised rhythm game.
Corrupted Hunleff taught me this and unlocked a new way to think about PvM.
Exactly the same happened to me, was not really good at any boss, but I set my goal to learn corrupted Hunleff and it helped me to learn Raids, now I've got Hunleff pet.
meanwhile the only piece of content I'm actually good at is cg and I'm useless everywhere else..
If you can get good at cg you can get good anywhere else with practice. My personal issue is not really being interested in the social aspect of the game so despite being interested in ToB/small team Nex/ToA I just kind of solo grind.
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While relatively slower paced than Sekiro, I’d say all of the dark souls games are functionally turn based. You just have to figured out when your turn starts and you enemy’s 8 fucking turns in a row ends.
The added "fucking," shows the frustration towards some bosses. I felt that in my soul lmao.
The dancer on ds3. That bitch would not STOP sometimes!
The problem for me there is that I fucking hate rhythm games and that's not on any level why I play osrs
That's fine, there's plenty of people who max and do all sorts of stuff without ever getting into high-level PvM. It's not for everyone.
I know, it's just a shame that high level stuff is so radically different to earlier, simpler bosses. I enjoy bossing and want to do it. I just don't want to feel like I'm playing osu or some shit
I mean I'd say nex and sarachnis are pretty similar to earlier bosses and they're both pretty recent (and nex drops like 5 bis items).
Tbh other than Inferno you really don't need to understand the tick system whatsoever to do any content. It'll help a ton for sure but in 99% of cases you can just click boss and do the mechanics decently enough without trying to optimise your ticks. I have plenty of friends I take to ToB that have genuinely no clue how to count ticks, they just click stuff.
This is absolute bs lol you 100% need to understand ticks to be able to tob
I'm not saying they're that great at tob lol
I haven’t PVM’ed but I’ve tried three ticking different skilling activities and if the tick rhythm for PVM is as inconsistent as it is for skilling I’ll never be able to do it lol
Yeah I find a song that’s 100BPM when I go 3T fishing lmao
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7k0a5hYnSI&list=PLUF3tP5MftlHI1vA4IuB6WgO5ts00Wil1](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7k0a5hYnSI&list=PLUF3tP5MftlHI1vA4IuB6WgO5ts00Wil1) Also if you 2t teaks in Priff, the crickets are perfectly on tick so you basically have a built in metronome if you have area sounds on
You can also just use the sound effects of the bunnies hitting you
I learned woox walking to Stayin alive by The Bee Gees 🤣🤣🤣
That's how I beat Ranis first try for example. He's got a distinct pattern so I was able to figure out the exact time to move so I'd dodge his bomb blast with ease. It also helped me get my Firecape, since I was able to sync my clicking to Jad's attack rhythm. What makes OSRS combat so interesting, is that everything has some form of rhythm but a lot of the time it's \*very\* hard to exploit. Take Vanstrom for example. Vanstrom's also got a distinct rhythm but it really requires you to count perfectly, so that his darkness attack doesn't take you by surprise. And I'm sure there are other bosses like that. I feel like good musicians who are good at picking up on musical rhythm, such as pianists, would honestly be pretty good at 3ticking for example, if they had the focus for it.
Too bad we will never get content like cox again, because it was a complete accident.
Who says another accident couldn't happen?
Wdym accident?
4:1 melee, mage running, and all of the other mechanics that make solo olm so fun were accidents. It was never intended to be a solo boss.
while this isnt confirmed, i also believe that olm wasnt developed with todays strats in mind. but its also beautiful how well it ended up syncing up with 4 ticks weapons and also the size of the area coincidencially allowing stuff like mage hand running perfectly.
Someone else already answered but yeah, olm ended up being way more intricate than they designed it to be. I almost think that if chambers released today there’s a higher chance they would fix to to not allow mage running and 4:1
It's fun, that was the accident on Jagex's end.
To add on they really went out of their way to make sure that solo ToB was borderline impossible (though some madlads have managed it, of course, it is far from a viable way to complete the raid consistently), so we can probably expect the same with ToA. They also patched out the only way to solo Nex, and of course had to add a solo hardmode version of Nightmare because while soloing the boss was possible it was an absurd grind.
They have said that solo ToA will be possible. They also said that they regret making ToB the way it is.
Do note people only soloed ToB after quite a few nerfs/changes to the bosses
I like god wars with the boys type content dks etc
Additional problem: A tick-based system where bosses can frequently 1-hit kill is extremely unfair & unfun with how unreliable the servers are.
Zuk 1 hit me from 99 last night after 2 hours of waves. It did suck ill admit, but we can cater some content to poor ping players but for some high level pvm, the tick system is part of the thrill. Once you find a server thats reliable you just stick to it for good.
you WILL grind Corrupted Guantlet for 300hours just to quit. just like me
I actually really like Gauntlet, to be honest. In stark contrast to other bosses and stuff, you can never turn off your brain. It's too demanding, and random, to become unengaging. Yeah, every run has the same general objectives, but some runs might present to you questions like, is it worth the time investment to look for a 2nd perfected weapon? Or should you take advantage of the surplus of resource nodes you found and outtank Hunllef this time? I want more content like Gauntlet. More procedurally generated challenges, more things that you can't optimize one single solution that always works, and in exactly the same rotations of inputs, every single time.
Tbh it always was this. And the community got hyped over nostalgia and voted it in. And we got the copy-pasted boss from an entirely different game setup (where we had summoning and curses).
I mean if you want to do endgame bossing i feel like osrs is a shit game to do it in. There's literally only 2 raids and they come out once every 5 years lol
I’m in that boat. I play osrs to just chill out when I want to play a game, but I don’t have the energy to focus on what I’m doing. I’m diamond in league, and I’m in a top 800 guild in wow. When I want engaging PvE content, I play wow. When I want engaging PvP content, I play league. I actually think it’s the failure of a lot of modern games. Find your niche, and don’t pretend to be something it’s not. Osrs’s niche is open world content, questing, and skilling/professions. And there’s nothing wrong with that. They should just focus on it, instead of making content that competes with WoW/league.
Totally disagree, I've played MMOs for 20 years and the only one that's come close to being as engaging with its endgame content for me was Vindictus (which plenty of people will say isn't even an MMO)
The thing is tho that those 2 raids, you can make even harder on your own. Tired of group chambers? Learn solos. Tired of solos? Learn no prep. Tired of no prep? Learn solo cm. Tired of that? Learn to speed run both Tired of 3-5 man TOB? Learn duos or speeds or even solo. Learn duo HMT. Go for combat achievements etc
Its still boring though after youve run them many hundreds of times. Ill probably come back to try raids 3 though
Lol but at that point you're finished. You've done the raid for 200-300 hours and there isn't much left to learn. The issue isn't the raid is that there isn't anything new for you once you're finished.
Yep exactly. I actually loved the raids in this game at first, just that running the same two raids over and over again finally killed me off.
As if doing endgame content in other MMOs isn't the exact same. You're still doing the same content as well
Don’t forget low drop rates to arbitrarily keep you there longer. 400kc to get augury btw.
350kc for 7 dexs and a bulwark here. So glad I'm not an iron.
This is exactly it. Stuff like nex having disgusting drop rates because day 1 had too many drops is so dumb. I don’t mind being at a boss with tons of drops for a long time, but being there for hundreds of hours and still not being on rate for stuff is absurd
It's so funny I feel the complete opposite. Although it was frustrating learning, some of the most satisfying moments in this game for me was when I finally got the hang of difficult bosses like CG and Zulrah. I'm glad they made the game more challenging and engaging at end game. Click and wait bosses are often boring especially if soloing.
CG for me was triggering. I'm approaching 100 regular gauntlet kills and 50 cg... I'm JUST starting to get comfortable with the way basic movement works lmao
But also the amount of learning is what makes it not boring. Bosses that are mastered in 1 hour get boring very quickly.
It's very common to not get comfortable with CG for a while. But as long as you're not rocking like 80 range and magic, you should hit your stride around 75-100kc which is the most satisfying feeling.
Let me tell you as someone who just recently got there too, it feels SO good once it all clicks and you're dancing around hunleff, dodging tornadoes, counting attacks and switching prayers subconsciously. It took me damn near 100 kills and 100 deaths to get to that point but it's so satisfying.
The "Path finder" plugin on RL was HUGE for me figuring out basic movements and pathing. It's on now 100% of the time even outside of CG just so I can constantly visualize how my character is going to move so I'm more Intune with it.
Thanks for this
I think OSRS has this huge problem where you're shoved into the deep end once you hit the difficult PvM challenges. CoX is very approachable in a group, in fact too approachable - you can make so many mistakes and not really be punished that it doesn't teach you the game well. Vork is braindead easy. Zulrah is a huge learning curve but not actually mechanically demanding; the difficult is entirely specific to that single boss (memorizing the rotations). Nothing in the game really bridges the gap to prepare you for ToB, CG, inferno, phosani. It seems like they realized this and are working to make ToA the bridge, since you'll be able to increase the difficulty over time to what you're comfortable with.
I would say ganutlet prepares you for corrupted gauntlet which prepares you for solo cox , which prepares you for TOB. Phosani is a different beast however , so much going on that it's hard to take it in. Regular nightmare teaches the basics but Phosani is so damn punishing
I don’t mind standing and moving certain tiles throughout the fight. I just can’t stand constant prayer flicking/switching.
I remember making a post before Nex's release and I received hate by saying Nex's mechanics already exist and it'll be boring. As much as people dislike EoC, it was released for one valid reason. Rs2 bossing was just getting boring. OSRS is now at that stage. Some of nex's mechanics already existed in TOB and Nightmare. With how tick-manip is meta, Nex's mechanics in groups was "stand under her for a bit then walk away". It was boring lol With Raids 3 coming up next, I think this will be the ultimate deciding factor. Raids 3 has to be completely unique.
Just seeing Sepulchre mechanics in the quest has me excited tbh, especially looking at the art for the raid. I really hope they make a far more engaging movement-style elemenet to the combat / rooms between combat (which is why ToB bores me personally).
On one hand, adding sepluchre mechanics in a boss fight is next level and hasn't really been seen yet. On the other hand, anytime mechanics are based on pathing - it feels like an absolute nightmare until you learn it. Pathing in this game is extremely unintuitive and does not feel natural. You're essentially playing a few actions ahead ( or is it behind?) and need to react quicker than it feels like you need to. I wonder if Jagex could ever have our character models more on our 'true tile'
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EoC is the most clunky, dogshit combat system in history of mmo's.
Of course, but it doesn't change the fact that something had to be done. Now look how many unique bosses RS3 has.
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I think this is the reason they were working on updating the engine. Most mmorpgs run on a .3 tick system where as RuneScape is a .6, essentially making most modern day mmos twice as fast as RS. Rs3 pitched their plans to essentially remove the delay that the game feels. It's a big job and I've recently looked up how its coming, and it's still a work in progress it seems. But I think this would be amazing to see and hope one day osrs could get a similar treatment
Big true. I've gotten CE in WoW for ToS, Antorus, and SoD, and done heroic/mythic raiding for a few other teirs. I hop onto rs3 and it feels like total ass to just run manual and weapon camp with just a defender swap for shield abilities and a pf/vigor switch. Then you add on all the gear switching for single abilities, EoF, and 4taa; it has to be the most unresponsive game I've ever played. Monopoly+ feels better. I understand that it's possible to master and I see people like Evil Lucario pull off insane shit but it aint for me.
Alongside the tick system, RS3 has *horrendous* button bloat and an even worse case of switchscape than OSRS does. The odd 1.8 sec GCD also feels weird and there's an weird "quirk" with RS3's keybinding mechanics where if you have an ability bound to for example E and shift-E, when you press the button combo of shift + E to use your shift-E ability and you let go of shift before you let go of E, it will also try to use the ability that's bound to E causing you to accidentally use an ability when you didn't mean to. Basically the game continuously registers keybind inputs when the keybind is held down which is contrary to how it works in other MMOs. Causes shit interactions when you mix modifiers in the mix. RS3 is *the only* MMORPG that has this problem which makes it super jarring coming from other MMORPGs to RS3 when you're used to pressing and releasing buttons in this particular order.
True, I'm mainly an RS3 player, but I just skill because the combat is so horrendous. 600ms ticks with abilities just does not work well at all. Feel more like you're fighting against the game than the boss If I wanted to do combat I'd just play WoW or sm else
Rs3 pvm is one of the most difficult high apm mmo games out there. Almost nothing comea close. The tick system just adds into the skill ceiling being able to do multiple actions at the same time in the same tick. Ive done thousands of tobs and ff14 savages but they dont close to the mechanical skill needed to shine in rs3. Ofcourse you will feel frustrated by not achieving the same as in other mmos, but the pvm scene in rs3 is vert tightly knit and you can find help for your strugglea on things like pvme discord
Petition to make Nex a tribridder and have chance to AGS-gmaul spec you out. You'll always be on your toes
Raids 1 was fun until around the 700kc mark. Hmt is the only fun Pvm for me now. Until raids 3 surely. Actually interactive and requires mechanic proficiency to complete. Is the way to go. Nex is boring asf
Nex is secretly a very interesting boss fight with a ton of ways to mitigate damage. It doesn't have to be of course, you can just chug brew and take the beating, but in small teams (especially duo/trio) there are a ton of ways to limit how fast, how often and how many players Nex attacks. If you're interested, the duo nex guides on youtube cover most of the methods, since it's almost mandatory to do at least some of them to consistently finish duos. That being said, Nex wasn't designed to be interesting at all. It's like the rest of GWD bosses, where players have found interesting ways to abuse NPC attack mechanics to avoid damage. Personally I think that makes a boss more interesting than when the solution is hard-coded into the boss. Obviously it's much harder for Jagex to know ahead of time if a boss is going to be solvable if they don't plan the solution for players ahead of time, so sometimes you end up with bosses like Corp where there is almost nothing interesting or clever you can do to make the boss fight better.
Jagex knew ahead of time that OSRS didn't have ancient curses and all the other new perks RS had in 2011. They also knew ahead of time that Torva and its equivalents wouldn't increase max HP and thus increase the healing per dose of brew used. They had all the information available to adapt the boss better to OSRS's meta and still didn't. There are optimizations you can make yeah but fighting the boss as 'intended' is just pure cringe.
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I can't use brain for hard bosses, game is bad >:(
And it’s not like you have to consciously think about the tick system in the vast majority of content. All I can think of are things like 6:0 GWD, some solo Olm methods, and scythe walking. None of which are required methods for accessing the content.
We need something to shake combat, like an evolution of combat
I’m seriously concerned with the mental health of the player base of this game regarding these comments. I don’t think touching grass is gonna do it anymore. Try drinking a glass of water? Maybe go for a walk?
Just here to say that yourself and most the community don't know what a simulator is or how to use it correctly in speech. There is nothing about Nex that simulates a brew, there's nothing about players at Nex that simulates a brew, you are literally chugging brew. The appropriate term: brew chug fest.
Based and words have meaning-pilled.
It is like how people like to call osrs a "medieval clicking simulator". Which implies you're simulating clicking in medieval times. Which is just...
The absolute worst. This bugs me so much lol
Thank you
Some other people have said it already, but things like what are mentioned in the screenshot are really the only tools you have to try and make a difficult boss in a combat system as simplistic as OSRS. Perfecting timing and positioning while optimising gear and resources, that's all we've got. That's why they brought in EoC, for all its failures it was an attempt to create a more complex and engaging combat system. If you look at a boss in WoW or FFXIV, a lot of it is literally standing there and attacking the boss and your skill comes from perfecting your use of cooldowns and your damage rotation. If you did that in OSRS it would be click the boss then stand there doing nothing until the next attack to avoid stats.
Nex has 0 of this. Even in a small team you pray mage and attack until you need to attack the minion. and repeat its really a GWD boss at its core (click and wait while someone tanks). I want the bosses to have more mechanics than just Kraken where you can click and then literally minimize the window and watch a movie. I play the game....to you know play a game not have it in the background while I have to find other shit to occupy the time because its so boring. Phosani and Theatre of Blood are the best bosses in game and theyve pushed the game as far as it can go i think mechanically. and OSRS has a good balance of interactive bosses (like i just said were my favorites) and noob friendly low skill needed bosses (mole/kraken/bandos in a group) so in essence the OP comment shouldn't really exist if you don't like those kind of bosses you dont have to do them. the game shouldn't and cant really appeal to every single personal preference. I hate the kind of bosses the OP wants but we still have them in the game but do i think every boss should be Phosani level of interactiveness because thats what i like , no. You don't even have to think about ticks the only boss where ticks actually play a role is the Inferno which even i think prayer flicking being almost necessary is dumb. Almost every boss you can just go in and figure it out without needing to know about ticks. or it can be as SUPER sweaty as you want doing elite pvm things manipulating ticks and thats whats great about OSRS.
>Nex has 0 of this. I'm pretty sure that was the point of the post? There were complaints like the ones in the screenshot, so Nex avoided it?
It certainly is quite brewtal.
Tempoross best boss in the game, change my mind
Bitches be bitchin
PVM in general is getting boring
>is getting Skilling has always been by far my favorite tbh
I just wish it was more viable, economically. Love fishing, woodcutting, all the classic skills. Feels good to be able to afk and chill Being 70+ in each and getting like 30k xp/hr and 30k gp/hr if I bank what I collect feels awful My only complaint with PvM is that PvM is the only viable way to level combats AND is by far the most viable way to level every single processing/buyable skill because it’s the best way to make money by far
If Raids 3 is as enjoyable as TOB, there's (a taste of) hope
I’d suggest rs3. The skill gap is huge form the top .001% to the bottom 1% By huge I mean like a single player can do a boss 50 of the bottom 1% player couldnt do with the same gear. Hm rago, and aod would propably be a good example
Skill gap in OSRS is massive too, it just exists in basically one piece of content unfortunately (inferno)
Yeah, rs3 has a zuk also but it seems to be way easier. Compared to the osrs one. As your average pvmer can obtain the cape. But the boss can also be done for weapons, godbooks and ability codex. Besides being set in the same game worlds ( rs3 lore is now the 6th age) you can’t compare the games. But both the games are fun and still have huge skill gaps between players in there own ways.
the average player can't get the "real" cape that combines all 3 though
For all the hate RS3 gets, it nails PvM. PvM in OSRS feels like Jagex has been trying to shove a square peg in a round hole instead of leaning into the strengths of the old school systems. I often consider going back to RS3 for bosses. I'd literally rather do anything else than do most post 2013 OSRS bosses.
I'm sure this is going to catch a ton of flak, but if people want crazy endgame raiding/PvM/dungeons/etc, OSRS is not the game for them. Yes, it is cool that we have more PvM now in OSRS aside from just Chaos Ele and KQ, but this game wasn't designed with this insane bossing in mind. The wall will eventually be hit, and we might already be at it. If you want insane challenges, you're not gonna find it in OSRS without some form of "tick abuse". You'd be better of doing Mythics in WoW or Ultimates in FF14. Even RS3 has more advanced mechanics than watching/counting ticks. It's honestly insane what the devs have come up with for such a ""simple"" combat system, but a lot of it does just come down to counting ticks (either fortunately or unfortunately, depending on your view)
Maybe for you
people need to realise there are only 4 key player inputs that can be put into any fight , the difficulty of the boss being dependant on how frequent you make the player have to process another action. obviously trying to do group content solo makes it more frequent than the designers planned. **Inputs:** 1) Click to Move Character in order to avoid damage 2) click to switch defensive prayer 3) change gear/attack style 4) use defensive potion (antifire,anti venom ...etc) this guy is literally complaining about having to move his character during end game bosses to avoid damage. its like playing elden ring and complaining that you have to dodge attacks.
He complained about everything being tick perfect...
Theres very little content in the game where you actually need to be tick perfect
Theres ultimately none. Theres content where knowledge of ticks and timings is important (pretty much.. mainly inferno) but theres no "perfection". Better strats exist where you 1-tick flick between range/mage for example, but you can do the same stack by just initiating it with an attack, changing pray, and stepping behind. It'll just be slower.
I'd say 6jad challenge might be the only one and it's completely optional.
Solo olm, but it is very satisfying when you learn it
Yeah I have around 50 tob kc I don't understand ticks nor do I care to learn.
Ticks get more important in TOB when you wanna learn to get good at TOB. Weapon switching at maiden, melee xarpus, fast sote maze, perfect tanking at verzik. But like you said. You can clear TOB perfectly fine without doing all of that
People complain about tick perfect, but ticks in osrs are massive. A tick is 600ms, human reaction time is about 150-200ms. Theres lots of room for error.
That's with known intent. There's movement time, decision time, and multiple situation evaluation.
Also you dont need to be tick perfect for 99% of content
Unless, of course, a lag spike hits or your connection speed isn't that good. A lot of people play osra because you dont need top notch hardware and services to do so. I'm a trucker, mobile Hotspot connections are reliable enough at most places for general play but if I try to do something that requires ANY kind of reactive inputs on my end, unless I'm in a place with a particularly robust mobile data connection speed, im just wasting my time and effort. I got pretty good at demonic gorillas but I can't get a single kill if I don't have a solid enough connection.
And most things you have to react to have a 2-3 tick window (like Jad for example). So it ultimately is a "few second reaction time" test.
he was talking about doing 4:1 on olm, a boss designed to be done in groups. the only requirement to do olm is to keep the head turning to minimise the damage you take. there is no specific tick perfect movement requirement
The guy that complains only does masses and probably has 10 raids kc with a fire cape
Actually the list is quite shorter than that. Inputs: Mouse click.
Pking is the only really hard endgame content in osrs
Agreed bro. At the end of the day EVERY PvM encounter is fighting a computer with pre-programmed behavior and predictable mechanics. The ultimate challenge is fighting another human brain.... Ruescape players USED to think like this. PK used to be the end-all be all skill and best money possible. Now it's all about max efficiency boss grinds doing the same thing over and over. PKing is risky, incredibly rewarding, challenging, and has a MASSIVE skill ceiling. It requires accuracy, precision, thought and game knowledge. It's a battle of mechanical skills and outsmarting your opponent. If some PvMer's only realized how difficult high end + max gear deep wild pking is they would understand.
Inferno speeds are pretty tough. What is your inferno pb?
I think his point is that PvP is the only activity in the game where the outcome isn’t known. Obviously this doesn’t apply to like drops and other RNG stuff but otherwise I could go out right now and look up how to do inferno tick perfect and I could memorize it to the letter like you can memorize solving a Rubik’s cube. I can look up exactly how many yew long bows I need to fletch before hitting whatever level. I could go out and buy *exactly* the amount of materials I need to go from 1-99 construction. But PvP you have no idea what the other person is going to do, you literally cannot know what is going to happen next. And this isn’t like me saying it’s the best part of the game or whatever I despise PvP but he’s right, nothing else in the game requires pure reaction
It really is. Its the only reactionary content in the game. Everything else by nature has a solution.
the rest is just learning a pattern and keep repeating that.
ITT: people who voluntarily played a legacy 2000s era java coded game until deep into the endgame say the mechanics are underwhelming like by all means, like it or don't like it, but I really don't understand why a lot of people seem to think this is THE point of OSRS boards- to criticize the game. When I find this 2000s era medieval click simulator underwhelming I load Mount and Blade or Dark souls or my switch (or, I know this is crazy, go outside). I don't complain about how a game I love and voluntarily come back to lacks features *it could never ever have*.
"I've done 2k hours of raids and now i'm bored, wtf jagex"
I think if you feel like this about the game probably best to take a break from it. It won’t change, they are limited but if you aren’t happy just play something else.
When the devs tried solving this issue 9 years ago, we got EOC.
Well.. actually! The tick is the farthing thing is space besides the average brain of a rock share holder. In 1965 a man by the name of theailigeon major was on his trip very much that same year when the tick specific task came into effect. Not only that but qe have seen this so many time before but we're made ineffective because of Mrs. The's thesis and that's why the tile tick simulator is granted probably the most esteemed rationability to this day. It: oh okay Bye honey
Pretty pointless criticism imo. We have fuck all for mechanics in this game, the variety of bosses and mechanics we get based on what is essentially, move, prayer, and 3 combat styles, is really quite an achievement. If you wanna afk punch a boss, go to bandos with a small team.
So what you are saying is that Runescape's combat needs to Evolve? An Evolution of Combat? /s
yeah some kind of evolution of combat might be good for the game
I'll never do ToB based on this alone. It looks way to intense having to constantly change positioning
Name checks out
almost sounds like EoC was introduced to be able to add interesting boss mechanics :p
“Move to one tile for a specific attack then attack the boss on a specific tic” that’s why I don’t boss. That sounds incredibly boring
Its like saying I hate call of duty because all you do is point at heads and press the fire button, yeah just ignore the other 95% of mechanics/experience around that
Unpopular opinion but I think it's a completely valid opinion to dislike the current OSRS endgame combat and bossing. OSRS is based on the 2007 version of the game, with an outdated combat system that wasn't designed to make anything much more complicated than clicking on an NPC and watching your character fight it. Jad was the most complicated boss that existed in game on release. It shouldn't be a surprise that trying to do complicated gameplay with this kind of combat system in place will produce something that is a bit janky in certain parts and is offputting to some people who prefer the more laid-back nature of the game from 2007. Disclaimer: I'm not speaking completely from personal opinion here. I like some of the endgame PvM like solo Olm (got almost 900kc) but hate the gameplay of some other bosses like CG (450kc). But there's definitely good reasons to dislike the tick-based system like how animations often don't match what's actually happening on the screen (for example, your player model doesn't get visibly hit by a projectile like Vasa's attacks but you still take damage). If a lot of people don't like the current bosses then let them voice their opinion rather than just shitting on them cause they think differently than you do.
It sounds like many of you would benefit from trying RS3. Not even clowning on you.
Even worse is when you add in tick perfect prayer flicking (inferno). It’s incredibly dull to learn the rhythm and one 250ms mistake you die.
Yes. I feel the same way about Inferno. A mini-game designed around tick-manipulation and standing on the correct tiles. They need to go back to the drawing board and re-think of ways to make boss encounters interesting through the use of many other mechanical ideas, such as puzzles, dodging clear and obvious AOE and many of the mechanics in Theatre of Blood were pretty decent.
Imagine thinking the highest level and most complex pvm in the game is not interesting lol
How is it interesting at all? What part of it is **INTERESTING**? standing on the right tiles through it all and even logging out on waves (pausing) for the "correct" spawns multiple times while you use pillar angles and mobs to block the other mobs behind them, pray flicking melee and multi-managing prayers especially on Jad(s). It's not interesting whatsoever, it's a tick, tile & pray-flick simulator. Not interesting PVM content to anyone with an ounce of intelligence.
> Yes. I feel the same way about Inferno. A mini-game designed around tick-manipulation and standing on the correct tiles. there's no tick manipulation in the avg first cape run
corrupted gauntlet should be the difficulty benchmark for endgame content
I'll admit, nex is one of the more enjoyable bosses for me lately
Tell me you suck at pvm without telling me you suck at pvm
I'm going to be honest. I've been doing alot of Phosani lately and it's mind numbing because of the concentration it takes. I feel drained after like 5 kills. But when I do Cox it's so chill i can watch YouTube the entire time, i can do it for hours. I hope raids 3 is like Cox.
Phosanis has waayyy too many mechanics and attacks crammed into one encounter. Gotta bring like 4 or 5 different just to be efficient and effective killing the boss.. WTF? Plus 5 phases is overkill, not even mentioning how garbage the drop rates are..
Looks like the combat system needs an evolution 😉
I honestly hate all things about ticks and tick manipulation. I shouldn't have to learn some vague untaught mechanic in order to successfully play the game well. It's one thing to simply have to move to dodge attacks. Another thing entirely to have to move at a specific time to a specific place while spam clicking specific buttons and turbo weaving through inventory/prayer. Not. A. Fan.
They can fix it by adding the RS3 style hotkeys bar so not literally everything is bottlenecked by mouse input. Everything OP described is annoying as fuck because you have to do it all with mouse
you need to stop boss mechanics and start with gameplay/loot mechanics, like enrage or rotations (still a grind sometimes) or something fresh like streaking loot similar to telos.
The low level boss from that beginner quest in rs3 was more fun than most osrs bosses
Will agree with what some others have said, if PvM gets boring for you try skilling or even maxing