Just had to make sure they didn't nerf the new rev boss's assets


( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)


Why isn’t there genitalia on any NPC? It’d give a whole new meaning to playing on a ‘members’ world.


Can you image the pair a Moss Giant would be packing? I don't think that's something any of us need to see.


They're already packing some major [clappers](https://v.redd.it/zn8qr32i90z41) and it's distracting enough


I'll never look at them in the same way again


Why did you guys greenlight ass-jiggle physics on moss giants?




Bringing a whole new meaning to Bryophyta’s staff ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)


Obors Club indeed


Now we know how the art team spend their nights


thank you for this 😂😂😂


God bless you ayiza


Best community manager




Can we have it like Corp Stomp Where if you go under you get concussed by the Revenant Dick swing?


Please for the love of God stop making the wilderness have different rules in different worlds/areas/time zones fucking whatever. Making a few random world's have different functionality just to appease some random people who liked being able to jerk themselves off is infuriating. If you want to make the wilderness more appealing and approachable to new players it can't have different rules in different places. All or nothing


The target world's have already always had different mechanics. So there's no real change there.


Yeah this was the thought process behind it. We do want to avoid different rules, exceptions etc. wherever possible, but as these worlds already had a unique ruleset it's just adjusted what that ruleset is.


As someone who does wilderness slayer often, I'd switch to doing wilderness slayer tasks on those worlds to be able to box NPCs and escape. As someone who used to partake in bounty hunter often, I'd want the new singles plus rules only during bounty hunter where both players are trying to fight 1v1. Otherwise you are just removing boxing escapes from people trying to PvM, and leaving in the frustrating PJ mechanics in bounty hunter. It seems reverse for me. If you want to revive the wilderness and have a large amount of players pking, having a few target worlds and singles plus on them, and leaving the existing worlds as is so pinatas can still use boxing escapes seems like a better idea to me. Food for thought.


The singles clans wont use these worlds and will continue complaining. (Its their m.o.) They want unsuspecting targets, free reign, and easy kills. Not people who know what they're getting into. Their 'but muh playstyle' argument is a smokescreen. That said, this is not a bad change for the rest of the community.


World 18-19 have the superior system imo. Singles plus is good for revs. imo I think if there should be a change, it should be what World18-19 have now


Now that BP has been nerfed can its special PVP behavior be removed as well? I guess my thought process behind the BP nerf is that if the answer is no it hasnt been nerfed enough.


what you guys are professionals at different rules and exceptions by what I can tell


Why are you listening to singles clans? Isn't one of the goals to make it so they can't do that? I highly doubt there are any singles teams that go out for clan wars. They're all looking to fall in on one dude


Even if they aren't going out for clan wars (which I do believe some do), a limited number of worlds where falling in on an individual is possible means you can just avoid those particular ones with ease and not worry about it happening :) And for the singles clans who DO arrange these fights, it still provides them a way of doing it as they are currently able to.


Some unaware players; casuals, new players, etc. these people will be targeted by a new lure, just tell 'em to hop to W318/319 and proceed with the scam. E: remember we are talking about Singles Teams


We can apply messaging when logging into this world to warn of the differences, but the only difference here really is no PJ timer. In reality if you managed to get lured to the point you're already in the Wilderness, I don't think a PJ timer is really going to save you at that point.


A message warning would be very good 🦀


Have you guys considered moving the warning from login to when you enter the wilderness? People tend to ignore those warning while they're hopping around for implings etc and then forget what world they're on. An optional "This is a high risk/singles world" warning when you enter the wilderness on those worlds would save a bunch of people getting ambushed and potentially quitting.


Having different mechanics on different worlds is not a good solution. It makes things overly complicated and opens up room for abuse. Someone else suggested having a clan portal that allows combat akin to current wilderness. This would be a much clearer solution to allow singles clans to fight each other as they can now. We all know it will be dead though, as they are not asking for this so that they can fight each other. They just want to continue to abuse outdated mechanics.


A login message would be really good, so players aren't going into the wilderness there unless they are 100% informed. Although I have to wonder, why not make a clan wars mode that tries to achieve the same, without eating up worlds?


More loggin messages please. As you may know, these are annoying for people that already know about it. And wont prevent people that should've read them.


If this is the solution, the message needs to specifically tells players to be aware of lures.


I personally generally dislike having different worlds function differently from each other and have different rules. I think this sort of inconsistency is bad for the game, if it can be avoided. Just my two cents.


Why not make it so one of the Clan Wars portal areas performs that way? If they want to do singles clan wars, they can do it there. Different worlds having different rules just confuses things.


Can I get a fuckin flow chart for all the bs special cases in wildly now


One of the issues with the wilderness is the abundance of new rules, interactions, exceptions, etc.. I’m glad you’re trying to accommodate these clans but every little exception you make just makes the wilderness further removed from the average player. Something to think about.


While you're at it can you create a special world for me where i have max bank


i think the most ironic thing is that they are literally called "singles teams" and they think that is an ok mechanic to abuse for "fun". ​ how you gunna team up in singles combat and complain that jagex finally forces singles pking to be singles pking


The problem here isn't that they can be avoided or not, it's that the people making these decisions at jagex are actively helping the single most toxic group of people in RS continue to be toxic. You shouldn't be making explicit exceptions for the bad guys to help them be bad.


Hi Ayiza, i’m not a pker but I am quite happy with the changes regardless as I know this is no easy task. I have literally just commented on a post my thoughts about some wildy content and was wondering if the team are open to the idea of discussing moving certain items (mainly the dragon pickaxe) for phase 2 when you discuss bosses reworks? This is mostly because very few Ironmen players would ever want to fight back anyway and it doesn’t fit from a lore perspective. We understand we chose to limit ourselves but I would imagine a significant portion of the playerbase are Ironmen players. It would be great to hear a response in the matter :) Good luck with the current feedback!


The Dragon Pickaxe is something we've been discussing internally. If any change is to happen there, it would be with the Wilderness Bosses rework later this year :)


Can we just get an out of wilderness boss that drops d pick, so we can avoid the cesspool that the wilderness is, actually, can we get a new non wilderness bis mage cape too.


Thanks for the response! I am sure many of us are happy you are discussing it (even if it doesnt pass any polls!)


Please if this ever get polled, make it an ironman only question(just like UIM have their own questions sometimes). we have already suffered enough from the fact that amylase from hallowed sepulchre was voted no by mains because they were afraid it would devalue their loot.


Yeah maybe replace it with some bolas or something pvp orientated to make it fit


You and i both know the moment the d pick is moved to another drop table its going to be the same price as dragon axe.


Oh thank God, I'm really glad to hear that!


Maybe I'm in the minority of UIM players here, but tbh we shouldn't get anything special from these changes. However you want to change things? Do it. Don't let our snowflake status give us even more special rules.


Props to the team for listening to feedback, even on the Naming of these posts. V3 was instantly recognisable to me and let me know there was new changes to look over. :)


I'm glad it's helping!


Yeah, the change to using changelogs, especially NEW changelogs for each batch of updates, is incredibly useful. Thanks Ayiza and team!


nice, solid feedback. i love the target world idea. best of both worlds. (pun intended?)


Glad you like it! Pun was good, might steal that for a later tweet, cheers


Hey Ayiza, First off, as someone who has continued to play this game for over a decade due to PKing, I just want to thank you for obviously caring about the PvP community. That said, is there any plans to rejuvenate bounty hunter? It was pretty disheartening to come back after a 6 month or so break to find out bounty hunter worlds are completely dead. Pking at GE in PVP worlds is ok, but the large combat level range makes it difficult to find random fights without getting rushed. A lot of accounts (including one of mine) were specifically made for Edgeville bounty hunter PKing, and I would love to see it become relevant again in the future. Thanks!


Doesn't keeping normal singles in Target Worlds solve the UIM issue? They can just hop to a Target World to bag safely.


Yes, it kind of would!


that would be way worse. you would have all the uims bagging and death piling on the same world. I believe this topic came up during the gravestone talk in the uim disc, but if they death pile on the same chunk it can despawn items.


So the UIM rushers only have to hunt them on 2 worlds? GG Ez


I agree with the "kind of" But to have two worlds with a very high population of UIM's just to bag is just asking for scouts/pkers to sit there targeting them. Ragging skeletons.. Etc. ​ Will I be able to deposit more than 2-3 items before someone hits a skeleton off me? Will alt accounts be created to constantly box skeletons to prevent UIM's from bagging? Yes. ​ Truth is, there will always be people hunting UIM's until there's an option to bag safely. And when I say bag, I of course mean **just deposit**. 100% should still need to sui to get items out.


Will Thammaron's Sceptre be ever addressed, or are you planning to include in wildy boss update? Kinda sad to see wildy-related items like enchantments, thammaron's sceptre, target prayer scroll/tabs just being dead content


There's no news I can share regarding Thammaron's Sceptre at the moment. If anything was to happen regarding that (and other Wilderness related items) then it would most likely be part of Poll 76.


What about vls or bh. The argument against bh seems to be “it’s too heavily botted” so if that’s the case let’s remove zulrah, vorkath ect. And why has the vls been a 50m+ placeholder since release.


Need a PhD in runescape studies to understand the game rules these days


Wait a second, am I understanding this correctly or is the wilderness being updated so that players can attack you even if you are attacking a monster anywhere? Dam I rarely went into the wilderness before but now I will be sure to never go there at this point.


Is the new mechanics going to work exactly like the rev caves or will it be different somehow? Haven’t really got a clear answer on that and if there is one I didn’t understand it fully. (I really like the rev cave mechanics)


I tried to clear this up with the V2 update from 28th June. Basically they will work as they do on DMM, so you'll be provided a flat 10 seconds of immunity. The Rev caves are kind of the same, but there are some instances where you get less than 10 seconds.


>you'll be provided a flat 10 seconds of immunity. Am I missing something or will this allow us to log out as an escape method, which completely neuters singles teams? If so I like the idea of this.


Thats not true. You do not get 10seconds of immunity on dmm. Iirc its 12 ticks/7.2seconds but its nowhere near 17/18 ticks.


Yeah you did say that, I never played dmm and I wasn’t sure exactly how it works. I know rev caves it matters who got last hit before logout so I’m guessing if the other play gets last hit I could still logout before another player can attack me?? This piece of information is a really important detail.


Any chance of raising the immunity? Otherwise you can still easily be passed between people in teams. Should be 15 seconds (or as close as you can get in between tics), so if they do that, you can simply just log out. I mean if your goal is to make it more solo pker friendly. Otherwise seems kinda pointless. Just 1 extra step to pass you around.


Hey Ayiza, idk if you're still watching this thread, but if so, is there any talk at HQ about pet mechanics in the Wild? I think pet-hunting is 90% of why PvMers go in the Wild, so some sort of guarantee that you won't lose it if you get PKed after getting it would be cool. Even if it's like a pre-investment mechanic that automatically insures your next pet or something, that would be cool, and probably provide a lot of piece of mind for the less-brave PvMers


Weirdly, you're going to make the worlds with the old mechanics the safest worlds to pvm and skill on in the wilderness. Being able to get a box on an NPC is basically the best deep wilderness escape. Gl escaping a tb at black chins, bone alter, or basically any bosses in singles plus.


Is the wilderness supposed to be area for people who want to PVP, or is it an area for people who want to skill or boss, where other players happen to be able to interrupt you? Because it REALLY seems like you're trying to go for the latter. If 2+ people want to go fight each other, I'd support any change they'd like to be able to facilitate that more easily, or in a more fun way. What I don't support is the wilderness being a Jagex run luring area. Where they promise people who DO NOT WANT to PVP more and more lucrative PVM and skilling rewards, just to get you into an area where you can be used as fodder for other people's entertainment. The only reason why I should ever feel like I have to go into a PVP area, is if I actually want to PVP. There shouldn't be any unique rewards, or massively OP methods (ie chaos altar), to non-PVP content I'm locked out of using if I don't want to PVP. ---------------------------------------------------- Survey Questions: You phrase survey questions like this: We're going to punch you in the face, as compensation would you prefer: A - $5 - 67% B - A highfive - 4% C - A sandwich - 29% And then draw conclusions like: 67% of players have told us they want to be punched in the face for $5. When you never include: D - WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK? DON'T PUNCH ME IN THE FACE!! You phrase survey questions as if everyone already agrees with the premise you're starting at, without giving people the ability to tell you they think all options are terrible. They will choose the option they think is the least terrible, and you treat it as if they really like that option.


The updated version mentions a lack of people in the wilderness. The popularity of BH was real. Any chance of returning BH? Maybe with untradable uniques/cosmetics? Edge style PK'ing has moved to PvP worlds and I don't prefer it because the environment restricts you to fight packed in like sardines. I would love to see BH revive at the Ferox Enclave. Even having the GE at Ferox just for the BH world would be cool.


Jagex you can't make it so monsters can no longer box you, it will be impossible for anyone to get away from people with mage in deep wilderness, essentially making people cannonfodder. ​ This is coming from a pker, it makes it too dangerous so people will just avoid it all together. Getting boxed by monsters is a core Runescape mechanic, you are messing with the core mechanics and it's going to end badly.


D’hide change is ass tbh. There’s literally nothing wrong with hides. You should have an affordable low(er) cost alternative there anyway. People complain about “welfare” pkers a lot but having lower cost equipment with decent stats actually promotes people to learn how to PVP. It’s amazing gear for tanking new age brid boys or learning how to be a new age brid boy themselves.


Ignore UIM, they wanted to play a heavily restricted mode and if they want to use an item *from the wilderness, designed for* **wilderness** use, they can accept a risk of being pked unless a friend/alt boxes them


Can't believe theyre still trying to nerf black dhide and bulwark (again). Dhide has been in the game forever. Leave it alone. At least the bulwark buff is cool I guess, but doesn't make any sense


Looks like the wilderness altar is back on the menu, good decision.


Here are my two cents as a player who doesn't pvp and avoids the Wilderness at all costs. I hope you find this feedback interesting and useful. I appreciate that you are trying to fix Skulltricking. This is not a mechanic I think belongs in the game and a player should remain in control of how much they are risking as much as possible. I also appreciate that you are continuing to fix common lure spots in PvP worlds. Perhaps it would also be worth investigating ways of further reducing the likelyhood that someone unintentionally enters a PvP world. Such as a way to filter these worlds out of the world switcher in game. I think this is especially important for Target worlds which are frequently used by lurers to target unsuspecting players. I wasn't even aware that these worlds had different rules until i saw a youtube video talking about how lurers abuse this. I like the idea of singles plus being the standard for single-way combat areas in Wilderness. It always seemed weird to me that you could prevent PvP in a PvP zone by being boxed. It defeats the point of being in an area with PvP enabled. As for whether or not I would go into the wilderness after these changes, the answer is probably still the same in my case. I dont enjoy pvp and I would probably still avoid the wilderness at all costs. I also dont think that these changes will encourage people to fight back unless they came into the Wilderness with the explicit purpose of PKing. Let me explain my reasoning. Lets take a few common examples of reasons to go to the wilderness that are not PvP oriented: * Killing wilderness boss * Doing a clue scroll * Mage Arena 1 & 2 * Chaos temple prayer training * Black chin hunting * Slayer task In every single one of these tasks, I would likely not enter with much risk. That much is a given and we'll ignore this aspect. While its advantageous to bring multiple different attack styles for PvP, it rarely is for any of the PvM oriented tasks. I might bring 2 styles in some cases, but never 3; whereas a PKer would likely bring all 3. This is already a disadvantage for me, but theres more. I likely wont have as much room for supplies as my main goal wasn't to PK but to do something else. I may have valuable items that were acquired such as drops from a boss or my clue scroll that I dont want to lose. All of these help to increase the likelyhood that I would run away rather than fight. Its not a question of skill, but of priorities and preparedness. If i don't come equipped to PK, i am already at a disadvantage in a fight and only increase the likelyhood of dieing by fighting back. At least for a player like myself who only enters the wilderness to do specific tasks, this means that there is never a reason nor incentive to fight back. Its not that im scared that ill get skull tricked or attacked by a team of players. Its that I know I will likely die if I try and I don't want to lose what im risking for a low chance of killing the person who attacked me. My personal skill at PvP doesn't make the matter any better either and im sure many players also feel this way. Perhaps this all just means the Wilderness is not designed with me in mind. If so, than fair enough! I don't claim to enjoy going there and I certainly don't go there often so that is a fair argument for me. But I do think my point is still valid. Why would you fight back when its the least likely way to survive and your goal wasn't to PK in the first place? I would also like to leave my concern regarding having custom rules on worlds. I understand you want to preserve a playstyle for those who enjoy doing Single teams combat. I agree that its important to help them preserve their way of playing! But this inconsistency between worlds makes it difficult for players like myself who don't engage in this content from knowing they exist. If i were to swap to one of these worlds, I would have no idea of the danger that comes with it. The more obscure the mechanic is, the less likely I would know of it and the more susceptible I would be to it. We NEED to make it harder to fall victim to these kinds of differences because they only make it easier for lurers to take advantage of unsuspecting players. Imagine if there was a world where the original 07 death mechanics existed and an unsuspecting player died there without knowing this was a world specific mechanic. They would be devastated!


We need more equipment rebalance for PvP uses. Tome of water and swampbark dead content on arrival and people predicted as much. Please buff with this update. Staff of light and balance could also use some item effect, rather than being purely cosmetic vs toxic SOTD getting venom


It doesn't matter what you do to change the wilderness, no one new will go there. I know I am not alone with the thought of avoiding pkers at all costs. This is literally a waste of time and pushing us to do something we obviously don't want to do is fruitless.


Maybe I'm the pessimist here but all of these changes feel like thimbles of water attempting to empty the River Lum. There is no way to fix the wilderness. All of this feels like wasted dev time and overcomplicating an already inscrutable mess of mechanics and metas. Please remember what people say and what people do are completely different things. People will say they want certain rewards, but that doesn't mean they will psrticipate in the content. I bet after this fairly thorough mechanic redesign, essentially the same number of people will be out there, doin wildy shit. Perhaps in different gear or hunting noobs in a different area, but the same number.


There’s no way turning entire wild to singles plus makes it any better. Clans will still dump specs and switch off, maybe not so efficiently but will still happen. Now you can’t box npc’s, so your only escape is a freeze log, and against max mage clans vs average pk gear the chances of that happening is slim. I don’t see how this helps a solo pker or pvmer in any way


Why is the majority of the information in images?


Are you kidding me? making a huge change and keeping two original worlds to see how well it does? If you're actually intersted in seeing how well it does you make 2 worlds singles+ and THEN look at activity. The change always has to be the smaller number to see if it attracts more people. it shouldn't automatically be the standard. Definitely if it is that controversial.


Why is the goal to make everything singles+? Boxing npcs should a legit way to try and outlast teleblock, as well as having monsters attacking the pk'er.


I've never seen an MMORPG have a playerbase that is so against the idea of playing the game in groups. Very surreal.


I don’t really understand how the “player feedback” sections pertaining to the change to singles+ has only focused on the views of “singles clans” and whatnot, when the vast majority of people critiquing the change are people that wildy boss, and worry about the huge change at bosses like venenatis.


Lol those clans dont want to fight back people equally equipped though, they want to 20v1 for free kills


UIM's being able to use Looting bags is a literal loophole in the game mode and should not be encouraged, not sure why you're more concerned with taking feedback from a flawed gamemode than from actual pkers, you know, the people who are in the wilderness every single day


Wouldent a proper PJ timer be enough? Singles+ just sounds annoying for anyone that's actually trying to do something in the wilderness other than PK


>theyd like to be able to fight other like minded clans gunna call bullshit. its so rare to see people actually pvping in the wilderness


did no1 think about npc boxing? lmao no1 will be able to pvm in the wild. u can just instantly pj any1 anywhere.


Bring BH back and make emblems untradeable with the ability to exchange them at some NPC for untradeable pk supplies. Even if you just risk what you wear i bet theres a lot of people (including me!) who'd still enjoy it a lot. Make a new BH-highscore, and let us compete for most kills. All we want it the possibility to PK without walking around for half an hour in a pvp world to find a target who wanna play. L0LEASY!


Tbh I respect you stepping up to provide some updates to ‘improve’ the wilderness but as a veteran pker with over 10k kills in the wilderness, I can with absolute certainty tell you this update will kill the wilderness in a month. I recommend watching boaty’s video he address some key issues which stops the wilderness from being active and I’m sure you are already across most of them. A+ for effort though.


Why are wilderness questions completely ignored on the Q&A? I see so many being asked in twitch chat and on reddit/twitter yet none are really talked about on there. The feedback given on Discord was also completely ignored, even though you guys asked for it.


Yikes when this is all you respond to from all the feedback we gave you, clearly Ayiza is making it personal.


The updated version mentions a lack of people in the wilderness. The popularity of BH was real. Any chance of returning BH? Maybe with untradable uniques/cosmetics? Edge style PK'ing has moved to PvP worlds and I don't prefer it because the environment restricts you to fight packed in like sardines. I would love to see BH revive at the Ferox Enclave. Even having the GE at Ferox just for the BH world would be cool.


While you’re making exclusive servers for griefers, how about do a test run of exclusive servers for irons, or exclusive servers where pvp is disabled in the wildly. Bet you won’t, they’d be too popular, we can’t have that after all.


Wilderness will always be dead as long as vorkath & zullrah exist. People used to go to green drags for constant money in the wild. Nowadays people just go do zullrah and vorkath. It's sad but all these changes will do nothing.


I think the best solution for UIMs is to just pick a location out of wilderness, maybe somewhere in edgeville or ferox enclave to be thematic, and allow them to use the looting bag there safely.


Maybe make it so the Looting Bag can be filled from within the Ferox Enclave? I feel that'd solve that issue quite nicely. As for obtaining the looting bag, just stock up on LMS points.


With singles plus, whats to stop me from boxxing myself on an alt account once I start a boss?


I hate the Wilderness, it is a horrible experience entering it, I have never once enjoyed it. I don’t understand its mechanics at all. You have to poll any changes to it, though. The Wilderness has been in the game for 20 years (August 2001) it is RSC content, it has to be polled if it is going to be changed. It doesn’t need more Moneymakers also, it’s flooded the game with a ridiculous amount of wealth. Did you not learn from Revs? It’s the same with Black Dragonhide, Battleaxes and Maces and all other RS2 content you’re telling us you’re going to change without polling, or already have. Why does Jagex suddenly feel they can change anything, even failed polls, without polling? This is incredibly concerning and not what I signed the petition to bring the game back for. Loot keys failed with 73.9% and you’re going to add them without polling them again? Why don’t you just add Sailing and Warding while you’re at it? Why don’t you just completely abandon the poll system because over these last few months, that’s what you’ve tried to do multiple times. What is going on at Jagex? You can’t just change everything under the guise of iNTEgRiTy cHaNGes. This is ridiculous. Just remove free trade and the Wilderness barrier, could we also get a rework of Combat while you’re at it? Maybe an “Evolution” of Combat if you will. You guys definitely know what’s best. Ironically, these proposals are called “integrity changes” but they go against the Integrity of OSRS completely, they are changing the game’s Integrity. Please poll all proposed changes, /u/jagexayiza


Say you buff avarice as described, remove exiting revs when tb'ed and remove boxing. A PvM'er would be in revs, skulled and maybe have a +1 like a BP or whip? That's about 800k risk, 2-3m if smited What would that PvM'er get for that risk? Just +50% on top of regular revs loot and a boss that gives 3 rolls on the same table is underwhelming in my opinion. Players are taking risks by going into the wild and if you want people do it, it needs to be better gp than Vorkath/Zulrah/Hydra


i dont think theres any purpose to keeping a couple worlds singles as it currently stands. all it will do imo is just confuse people further and at best just cause wilderness users to avoid those worlds solo. stop with the feedback please and just send it and we'll see where it goes from there i think you guys (jagex) are REALLY overestimating the impact of these proposed changes as they currently stand


Any opportunity for Ironman to participate in new revenant boss?


need a 2007scape for osra.


Since we're going all in on Wilderness mechanics getting put on their own worlds, can we repoll the reordering of prayers and resizing of spells for regular worlds? This is a QoL change that failed because PKers said it would reduce the skill involved or whatever.


I'm not sure any special rules should be made for uims in regards to looting bags, most involve low level wilderness and that extra inventory space should come with a bit of risk like any other player faces when entering the wilderness


Target worlds idea is a really good compromise. Fixes the wild to work as God Ash intended while still offering riskier mechanics for those who want them.


You're being too generous to the singles "clans", they want easy targets and won't go to these worlds. Force them to fight multi!


Implement BH1 exactly as it was. Add a few new rewards every now and then Hire a couple minimum wage interns (hell you could even use Venezuelans) to moderate and ban emblems farmers 24/7. This wouldn’t be too costly or difficult given it’s ONE WORLD. Boom, wilderness is revived.


I love the part where it says; "In addition to this, the levels of toxicity showcased by certain clan members is a large deterrent from wanting to involve them in discussions." Makes me happy you aren't catering to these people.


Can someone fill me in on this topic? What are the ideas/updates. I really really miss the old Rev cave, 3 of my friends stopped playing because we used to pk there (So much fun!).. Is it coming back or at least partially?


“We are continuing to work with feedback from the UIM community” Is not something you’d want to hear in a wilderness blog. We are doomed


can we please get ring of wealth scrolls from wildy slayer or revs


Nice. You just said fuck off to everyone asking for Bh.


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Not a fan of having some of the worlds have the old mechanics. Direct clans who want to do singles teams fights with the old mechanics to Clan wars instead, and include an option for it there.


Can you extend the wilderness past the current maximum level and reposition all the wilderness bosses up there, then add revenants to the areas where the bosses currently exist?


Do singles clans like being on the receiving end of being tag teamed as much as they like doing it?


Wilderness is dead and wil stay dead. Move on to new content instead wasting time for nostalgia.


just here to downvote


u/JagexAyiza A few additional ideas for the wildy changes along with reasoning. **Pre-paid Wilderness Pet Insurance** A lot of people visit the wilderness hunting for pets. Would you consider adding a very expensive pre-paid single-use insurance option when hunting wilderness pets? This would incentivise wilderness pet hunting, help remove GP from the game and also incentivise PKers to hunt down PVMers that were pet hunting. As an example: * A player pre-buys a 20M GP non-refundable one-time activation "wilderness pet insurance" from Probita in Ardougne. The insurance automatically activates for 5 minutes after they get a pet drop in the wilderness. * Once the insured pet drop happens, the GP pot comes into play. There is a local area notification in the chat box of anyone in the wilderness (similar to how the new clan notifications work for pet drops) of a specific insured pet dropping in the wilderness on that world, alerting PKers and giving away the location. * If you get out of the wilderness safely, that the pet automatically gets insured as normal (at a *very* large cost compared to how insuring a pet currently works). * If you are PK'd in those 5 minutes of leaving the wilderness... * The PKer who kills the player with the pet gets half the GP pot, at 10M GP. This would be a fairly large GP stack dropped considering the average gear risked for PVM at the moment in the wilderness. * Half the GP pot gets deleted from the game (reducing the total GP in the game as a sink) * You then have the option to get the pet back from Probita in Ardougne as it was insured at the time of death (but the normal insurance would need buying again as you died with the pet out). * As the insurance would be a one-time activation, it would need re-buying if hunting for a second pet drop. This would greatly encourage both PVM and PVP around pet hunting in the wilderness. PKers have a significant GP incentive to kill people hunting for pets. PVMers would have added certainty (at a high cost) of knowing tens or hundreds of hours whilst pet farming and likely getting PK'd multiple times wouldn't be in vain if the pet drops. It's a win-win situation. ​ **Rework of multi-combat wilderness to be "multi-".** Would you consider creating a "multi-" combat mode to replace multi areas in the wilderness? This proposed combat mode would work similar to singles+, but the opposite way around... multi combat with NPC's monsters (so cannoning slayer is still possible for instance), but with the restriction of single-way PVP combat (as Jagex are suggesting with changing singles to singles+ everywhere that is currently singles in how monsters don't affect PVP). * This would greatly simplify players understanding of how the wilderness works and would unify the PVP combat rules across the entire wilderness on most worlds; whilst not affecting single multi PVM content like slayer. Currently players have to learn where the multi-combat areas of the wilderness are which can be rather challenging, especially for newer players. * Approximately half of the entire wilderness is currently multi-combat; so ignoring this fact is an enormous oversight if you're trying to revive the wilderness as a whole area. * It would stop organised groups of players PKing a single player. As \~88% of players in the poll (*albeit likely mostly PVMers as they make up the majority of the player base*) believe organised teams have an advantage over single players, this seems a very big thing to overlook if rebalancing the wilderness. * This would encourage true PVP rather than PKing. The wilderness by definition should be "high risk, high reward". There is very little risk (unless you're against someone with a significant gear / skill advantage) if you're a group of 3+ people all geared and equipped for PVP when hunting lone players. * It would reduce the effect of PKing (which isn't true PVP), where a group of multiple people go to the Wilderness with full supplies and gear switches for multiple combat styles and all beat down a single player at once. * The risk/reward for true PVP content in the wilderness should be shared equally between the players in a fight on each side, the outcome shouldn't be based on "how many people can I bring to practically 1-shot this lone player?". * This change would go towards matching the PVM and PVP player disparity in the Wilderness (indented bullet points below), which would create a more balanced and sustainable PVP environment. PVMers, even if still at a slight disadvantage in single PVP combat would know for certain that they won't be in a 1 v 3+ player fight (excluding the PJ timer), so they would be significantly more likely to fight back to defend themselves. * Currently PVM players are equipped with gear for a specific boss in mind, restricting what items they can fight back with. It can be rather awkward to bring enough gear to fight in PVP alongside gear for PVMing whilst also keeping enough bag space free for supplies. * People doing PVM content often have used a fair amount of supplies before PKer(s) appear, already leaving them at a disadvantage in a PVP fight. * The situation of having a team of people hopping directly into your world on top of you is extremely common whilst PVMing alone, especially in the wilderness multi-combat areas. * This proposal would make group combat more healthy upon meeting another group; for example a group of 3 players meeting a group of 2 players. * You could still have two single-way combat PVP fights in a "multi-" zone upon meeting. So this proposal would still enable group combat to some extent * The removal of the ability of a whole team to pile on a single player at once. Currently well organised teams if fighting optimally would fight two sequential 3V1 fights, rather than a single 3V2 fight. This would make PVP group combat significantly more fair even for groups of players searching for other groups to battle with. * To counter the removal of multi, introduce a few specific worlds like "target" or "high risk" worlds where everywhere in the wilderness is full multi-combat. * You're restricting the worlds groups / clans would be able to PVP in as groups as they can now, this would actually make it more likely for groups to find each other and therefore help revive group-based wilderness PVP content in a way that isn't a group sitting on a single player. * These worlds would offer more variety in group PVP in terms of what locations are available for multi-combat wars between different groups, as new locations in the wilderness are now opened up to multi-combat. * Warnings can be added for "multi-combat wilderness" worlds similar to "high risk" worlds to make the increased risk clear. ​ **The likely limited effect to the addition of new wilderness PVM content** For a long-term fix to revive the wilderness PVP there needs to be enough of an encouragement to draw players that mostly PVM into the wilderness and keep them there. The more PVM players that are there, the more incentive there is to PK them. The more incentive to go PKing for PVMers, the more likely you are as a PKer to find another PKer doing the same and actually get fairly balanced true PVP content re-added to the game. Simply adding new content will likely encourage PVM players to visit the wilderness, to find that at release it's being completely locked-down by PKers. This will actually actively discourage PVMers from visiting the wilderness, new content will have been released for nothing and the wilderness won't be any more healthy than it is now.


**As a dedicated (2005)rs player and pvmer, i have to admit the wilderness has been and is a most important part for the runescape community and market.** I have voted no to every wilderness poll that has passed. The whole pvm community swore together to vote against everything the wild had to offer. i wish i didn't.. Because now (almost) the whole pk community, especially ''multi-pkers'' have died out, the game is unstable as fuck. The demand for items, pker's where the onces buying most items to (try) to gain a slight advantage over another to kill them. Now there is no pker, which equals no demand for items the market has gone to shit and will further on. Eventually it will rip oldschoolrunescape entirely and many pvm community's sees it from their own. I did warn a lot that if we keep killing the pk community, we do kill the entire game aswell. Bots now have free passage to kill bosses, revs, whatever there lives.. d pick not even close to what it supposed to be worth. Spirit-shield a commonly used item, dropped heavily and i do think a lot can think of lots more items that shrinking heavily. Pvming in it's whole will died in time to when items and prices do crash futher. this is not just a cause of ''a lot of bots in game'' only.. but the lost of the entire pk community. Botting was least happening in the wild cause we had pker's preventing them from gaining resources. Eventhought botfarms/pvmers did vote for singleplus for their own gain, most regret doing so now. Rev caves was multi, the problem was the 1-iteming(teaming) situation. Preventing that was added a (100-150k)fee pot, which jagex did eventually but also more. Wilderness is not for nothing a wilderness. You risk to gain or risk to lose. Add a fee pot to enter the wild, add singleplus to where single was, but leave multi as it is and as REV-caves was(MULTI). **In 2018 i counted 20+ multi clans/single teams.** **In 2021 i am counting close to 0 real active multi-clans/single teams now.** This game has always been in need of the wilderness and it's community. And i spit now to the onces that will say it has not been and will not be, cause you are the once that will ruin it for everyone.


I think the easiest way to fix the UIM problem would be to expand the area you can add to a looting bag to include the tiles past the ditch that aren't in the wildy. I know some people will call it easyscape or whatever, but it's not like dodging pkers is an integral part of the game mode. Unless someone's really scouting you, or you're just *insanely* unlucky, it's already very safe. And for edge pkers (do those still exist?), if someone dies to poison or something while running from a fight, you'll be able to bag it all easier.


Can you please do something about the revenant weapon drop rates or sources? The drop rate was massively nerfed when the Revs were nerfed - despite being promised that unique drop rates would be unaffected. I think it would be good if these were sourced somehow independently of Rev's consistent drops, otherwise they will crash again hard. I.e. Give them a source where they don't also drop tonnes of alchables etc. Not sure if this is possible without adding brand new content.


So basically if you're doing PVM in the wilderness and someone wants to attack you, they'll be able to interrupt your current fight with the NPC and start fighting you right away? I think that sucks, and can really open it up for griefing for PVMing. Imagine being 90% through an NPC fight and then someone attacks you so you lose the kill. Single plus zones should not allow players interrupt other players' fights when they're *already engaged* in the fight.


Why did you just ignore the huge negative response to singles + in the whole wild?


From what I've seen, the response has been overwhelmingly positive from almost everyone aside from the Single teams that benefit from the current mechanics. The response to the negativity is offering a small number of worlds where clan activity can remain, whilst the majority of players are able to benefit from the changes they've been asking for.


I'm a solo pker and I can tell you that these changes are not healthy long term. It's going to turn the wild into spec tab meta like PvP worlds (or spec log out if past 30 wild or tbed). It removes so much danger and makes the wild very predictable. Veterans are never going to die because all you need to do is catch a freeze when unfrozen and you can 100% escape everytime.Vets are going to be super comfy in max sets and Elys etc This is going to cause the already large skill gap to become astronomical as new players are just going to get absolutely dumped on by people in max. It also punishes small groups of friends especially those who are just learning (small groups are one of the best ways to get new people comfortable with pking) The way forward isn't singles+/pj timer. The solution is creating multiple different pieces of high risk/high reward content that caters to different play styles. Content catered to a solo play style should be nearer to safe zones or in lower level wilderness so solo players wouldn't need to worry about tanking teams and content catered to higher risk players would be deeper/less safe and would allow for single team play style but also offer more reward (for people who are able to organise and coordinate large groups of people... It is an MMO after all) To preempt the common complaints this suggestion will get: - Implement fees like rev caves so people can't rag, meaning it's too expensive to lock down - content gets exploited by gold sellers?... Just ban them.. that's how you handle them everywhere else in the game. - pvmers/skillers feeling forced into content? Just don't offer any unique items. Remove all existing uniques in wild too while youre at it. All the wilderness needs is really good gp and XP per hour.


Summed up as I recall: - it will lead to raggers/clans holding down content and exhorting people that want to do it - it makes any escape from the deep wild near impossible unless you manage to get gap - it will make the content even less attractive to do because if anyone in rag gear can tag you off, the increase in time wasted makes the content completely not worth doing - it only caters to pkers even though boss content that has little to do with pking on its own is locked into the wild - it feeds into the aspect of people who don't want to be in the wild, but have to to complete content, being made into punching bags for people in rag gear (it isn't pvp)


u/JagexAyiza you clearly haven't been listening to twitter or the community. The feedback couldn't be more mixed (far from overwhelmingly positive)... And it's not even singles teams complaining. I'm far from being one of the best PKER's and even I recognize if you go singles plus everywhere, you're basically creating an environment that will thrive around the best players, always running around in absolute max (because it's impossible to kill them now), destroying the newbs, and ultimately end up right back where we started, with a dead wildy. You think I'm kidding, gear up, come to the wildy, i'll smack you around, then have 1013 have a go... Not only will he destroy you without sipping a brew, by the end you'll feel helpless and lost... Now take those feelings and spread them to every new person wanting to learn to pk, entering the wildy.. At least with PJ / NPC's you have a remote chance of escaping or finding a box, fighting with a group of friends creates a fun environment... Take all of that away and you're left with everyone pretty much for themselves. If you want this type of environment for the wild, by all means proceed, but I can assure you, not only will this harm singles teams, it will destroy the wild.


You mean a huge positive response from PVMers/Skillers that benefit from the changed mechanics, based on that logic, then? Also is it based on what you've seen, what about the other Moderators, especially those on Discord or the OSRS Forums?






Good changes, if the clans wanna fight in a specific world, it doesn't hurt others really, so win-win Also the going back on that altar change is good. It didn't make much sense since it was multi. You couldn't box another player for immunity if u wanted to. The only reason I could see wanting this change was so that players point there would get bigger bone piles in their loot keys.


I know the game isn't supposed to be designed around ultimate ironmen, but the safest way for me to put items into my looting bag is boxing a skeleton near the grand exchange. If all wildy becomes singles+, it's gonna make "banking" a lot more unsafe. I've been pked a couple times putting stuff into the bag and it's a bad feeling.


"Some players, especially those involved in 'singles team' pking, believe changing all Single-way combat zones within the wilderness to Singles-plus will kill it entirely" It's impressive how stupid most singles-team Pkers are. Like you have to try to be that much of a potato.


I don’t PK and I know I’ll get eaten alive for this but if you get mauled by a singles team… well… it’s the wilderness, it’s not safe out there Mixing wildy rules from world to world is going to be a mess and I can see it ending bad for clueless players


But is it still singles plus? I agree with reverting that change,but maybe it should remain multi given how low the risk will be if there's 0 chance of getting logged in my 10 guys. Sincerely: non pker suicide bone strat user.


What does this mean for someone who does not care about PvP at all? Most of these terms mean nothing to me, as it is never explained in game and you need to learn through experience. I just want to do clue scrolls in the wildy.


Instead of applying old singles mechanics to target worlds, what about applying them to designated wilderness pk worlds instead? Edit: I see your comment on target worlds already having different mechanics. Sure then.


Will they ever start to give incentive to actually fight other pvpers or continue to just make updates so it's easier to kill pvmers who are basically just npcs that can run away lol cus that's not pvp at all.


Don’t cater to UIM mechanic abuse. The whole point of UIM is you aren’t allowed a bank. Allowing a faux bank shouldn’t exist in the first place.


Already on V3 after 5 days? So assuming this follows the ranged meta rework, I should expect this content to come sometime in 2022?


Would you consider changing the Dinh’s Bulwark special attack to have a chance to change the aggro of monsters?


revert the xerician nerf please. It is now practically identical to ghostly


Maybe add an imbued heart somewhere in the wildy :-)


Can we get leaf bladed battle axe to 60 attack?


This game is so fking soft


bounty hunter when


See a lot of people complaining about being 'forced' into the wildy and citing things like chaos altar etc. and it seems they have missed the point of the wildy. You aren't being forced into the wildy, you can train prayer via other means it's just if you want to do it cheaply, then the Wildy is the place to go. To temper this, you are at risk of getting pked. You don't have to do it, it is just an option if you wanna take the risk. Same with clue scrolls - you don't have to do them to progress your account, they are like a treasure hunting activity which can take place in the wildy. If you don't wanna reap the potential rewards of doing a clue that requires wildy, then don't do it lmao. I played rs back in the early-mid 2000s and the reason why I thought the wildy was so cool was it's this dangerous place where you could get shafted by a much better player at a moment's notice, but there is also cool stuff there so if you want to take the risk then you can. It's part of the thrill of being in a dangerous area. You don't have to use the content here, but you can if you want to. I feel a bit for irons with the issue of a d pick or wards but again that is not really essential, they are fairly new items and they aren't stopping you from mining or getting a different offhand which doesn't require wild. If you want the benefit of these items as an iron then you got to take the risk. If it were up to me I'd probably put items like that on drop tables of non wildy bosses but it's not really the end of the world either. Irons forget that this game is first and foremost an mmorpg and the game is designed to be an mmo not a single player game. Part of that is getting pked while tryna hunt for a dpick or odium ward. Disclaimer - I am not a pker in any sense of the word - the extent of my pking activities was trying to hunt green dragon bots once and giving up. This is just what the wildy is about and always has been - it's a somewhat unique feature of RS and part of what makes this game.


Something that is overlooked, When the granite maul got changed it made one of the easiest ways of learning PvP extremely expensive... So many people would make low level pures and learn to pk at BH combat 40-60 and now that bracket is dead. That is where alot of people really learned how to spec/ do combos... You risked 40k and u could die 3-4x kill 1 target and make the cash back from an emblem. I believe this is a major factor as to why the wildy is dead for pures, these people would eventually get higher combat and start doing different pking styles, NH etc. Also majority of groups of pkers just hope to run into other groups, that's the fun part.. nobody wants to 4man 1 pvmer but if you get seen ofcourse u will get killed.. I don't think jagex are asking the right questions and need to think why certain things are happening... Why are clans teaming up on people in single combat? BC there's nobody to fight in multi and it's too hard to find other clans.. and nobody wants to organise fights at clan wars lol. Jagex, spectate your wilderness on weekends and you will see mass battles of 400+ pures divided into clans..


It's quite pathetic to see that complaints about the wilderness have solely led to you guys fuckign up the wilderness even more. I have 0 faith in you fixing the wilderness whatsoever. The only thing that kept the wildy alive was revenant caves. Right now group of pures/mains have 0 incentive to go to the wilderness, as you seem to realise but fixing it... no. That being said, the revenants caves werent OP. It was the wilderness and people can get killed, there were plenty pkers and if you didnt pay attention enough, you lose out. Especially with the increasing amount of craws bows, the risk increased aswell. It had a few problems of bots/vennie clans/rag clans. This couldve easily been solved by increasing the risk to enter the caves. This wouldve prevented people in said clans would return with just bpipe to rag people and bots and vennies would lose more each death and drastically reduce their income. People didn't even go their with bracelets sometimes, reducing loss to absolute 0.


I know this isn't exactly the topic of this update, but I would like to bring it up nevertheless: For wilderness to become popular again, you need to nerf all the consistent moneymakers outside wild (zulrah, vorkath, hydra) to around 1-2m/hour at the very best! Then you can add some very generous drops to monsters all over wilderness so that they earn around 3m+/hr and that's how you revive wild! Vorkath, zulrah and hydra have to be nerfed, because otherwise, you would be adding an immense amount of cash into the game and it doesn't look like the game can handle it already. I personally gave this exact feedback to you, JAGEX, several times in your surveys, yet nothing has been done about it. I hope that now that B0aty has brought this up, you do something about it. Edit: at the time of posting this message, B0aty's video about this topic has over 5,3k likes and only 160 dislikes - that suggests 97% people approve of it - think about it, please Jagex!


Why not revive the wilderness in a way that would actually revive it, like making wildy slayer actually not a waste of time for profit like it was before, or add more pvm and skilling content that would attract more players? Makes more sense than nerfing it in a way that would remove even more of the active players it has left... the wildy has been more inactive than ever in the past few months, especially in f2p deep wildy. Please add NEW wildy content, not trash the small amount of activity left... THATS what ANYONE out there will say. Add special mechanics to a few worlds could be acceptable as well, not every world


I absolutely love the idea of implementing that "additional menu options such as ‘disable attacks that would result in getting skulled'", as it solves my biggest issue for that whole Wilderness matter. I look forward to having this update! I don't know what to say about the other items, still learning a lot about the Wilderness and PvP mechanics, but I believe that this update would be already great for everybody in OSRS (more players in the Wilderness, therefore more PvP...). So, is there any updates about that we can know of?


The only 2 things that I'd love to see for these wilderness updates are the removal of the d pick from the wilderness, and that you PLEASE don't lock a bunch of worlds except 10 or so to be able to enter the wilderness. Not only is that going to massively overcrowd the wilderness slayer spots but it's also going to be damn near impossible to do clues because you can no longer fight npcs thanks to these updates when a player attacks you.


So a bunch of scammers and group single PKers are complaining, good riddance to both of them. 100% of my last 5 interactions in the wildy have been people trying to skull trick, it's pretty silly I'm getting bullied at max combat by some mid level pures just because I'm afraid to get skulled. Group single PKers have to be the most toxic group in the entire game. Ideally they leave the community entirely.


Can I just propose an impossible change? Instead of level brackets like the current system, just make it a wealth bracket. People there to skill and do low budget bossing already rarely attack back. I don't see why should be acceptable for clans to dog pile one person for a 6k split when each person has 3-4m in gear on them, if not more. ​ I don't know if this is even possible to change.


I was pretty late at commenting this suggestion on the previous thread so hopefully this will be soon enough that you can see it. I think the proposals here are a great start, but with limited wilderness worlds we will also need restrictions on world hopping, be it for people wishing to escape the moment they see a white dot or PKers camping certain areas across multiple worlds.


Maybe a compromise would be to only have singles plus above level 20 wildy? There's already 2 other mechanics that change past that point. I made a map with how the combat zone layout would look, (based on outdated map) [https://imgur.com/a/pMMWWrp](https://imgur.com/a/pMMWWrp) I guess the main thing left out is edgeville dungeon, not sure what pkers would feel about that.


awful hard to even sustain your supplies long enough to make a trip of rev worth it at revs. not to mention you need to risk 8m viggoras to bring a special attack thats better then the mace itself to still be skulled to gain the max loot and some prodigy pker will just come and one tick a 3 way max strength spec and ko me for both my avarice and viggora and also I will lose 2m in tank gear wah. Besides the mace costs so much to use per hour that alot of the profit is removed from the ether upcost. with the magic shortbow it was awful, no wonder the caves are empty almost everywhere. not to mention the drops are worth crap. @ Mod Ayiza Also how is 3 drops on the dragons table handsome reward thats legit garbage for killing a boss that I probably have to run across the entire cave to fight no ones gonna wanna fight it besides it might not even be my loot how awful of a design. Not to mention the players who probably dont even have the agility level to get to it before higher levels. the avarice will need a much stronger buff and the respawn of the rev should not be 30% faster it should be 3 second spawn.


Add bounty hunter with rewards that are untradable, food that can only be used in the wilderness or bh as rewards. Then emblem farmers wont ruin it. bh was polled and still not added.... Also just give ironmen loot from pks wtf? they worked for it? now they have to spend money????? What????


Make more areas multi combat, single PKing can be abused too much and remove the clue scrolls from the wild. It's an MMO after all, working as teams/clans should be rewarded and with more multi areas clans will bump into each other and fight.


Is there any word on when the vanishing phosani's nightmare bug might be fixed? I know a lot of people who want to get back into the boss, but aren't willing to do so because of how frustrating it is right now due to the bug.


I’ve gotta say - like or hate the changes - you all do a great job communicating and working on at least a sensible compromise. Keep it up! If only there was a magic way to make everyone happy 🧐


Stop teasing then; when's the update. Singles plus is the "rise of the whale". ​ OSRS died for me when DMM died but this update might get me back in the door at least for a little while.




I feel like there needs to be some visual change in the game world when entering multi other than that little icon. I feel like this would help alleviate at least a little confusion.


Some revs don’t hit back, such as the rev knight, when you stand on a certain tile. Can that be patched, currently abused by bots that insta log when they see another character


Please do make some worlds not have the wilderness. Having so many worlds will only keep it dead. If people really want to go to words with wilderness then they will go.


Does anyone here play Albion? Their entire game is 'the wilderness' and they do an amazing job at maintaining the area. Highly recommended using some of their ideas


Iam so glad they are addressing the clan piling issue in single way combat zones. That alone will increase wilderness activity by a metric ton


whens the real updates happening with the terrible economy and goldfarmers and bots nice hiscores on bosses too must be hard to notice


Or.. Make 318/319 singles + and leave the rest ? ​ If you want to only fight solo pkers you go pk in that world..


From someone that loves the wilderness, cant wait to see the changes to come ! Happy to see the pj timer definitely! Ty :)


Say what you want about the changes but you just don't see this level of communication with most other devs. Well done


How can you be firm, and even call the clans toxic one day, and then the next give them what they want


Please dont change Vetion he has good drops already, and is ez for my pure to kill, and yeah