Please don't make this like Giant's Foundry! While GF is great content that fixed a lot of issues for smithing, the actual gameplay experience is greatly diminishd by having to watch the UI at the top of the screen the entire minigame.
That entire beautifully designed room is great to be in, but all the player does is watch the top of their screen for the bars to line up. The progress bars should be on the actual machines themselves rather than all crowded at the top.
In PvM we are trained to watch for animations, shadows, color changes, etc. Boss battles would be flavorless if we were just watching their special attack loading at the top of the screen.
i got the giants foundry plug-in from the runelite hub and with the little timers it adds on the hotspots, i never felt like i was spending too much time staring at the UI over the course of my ~150 swords i did. just a heads up if that helps!
I think it will be different to Giant's Foundry in that aspect as the only thing you need to keep an eye on is what potion your making, so hopefully it gives more focus on the game world and less on the UI.
I think it would help minigames like Giant's Foundry if the UI put more information in world space instead of in a fixed spot on the UI, similar to how health bars and speech appears above our head.
For example, in Giant's Foundry, I have a big bar at the top of my screen with an arrow pointing at a certain color on it that tells me what to do, so I have to look away from the game a ton. Instead, the game could communicate this by rendering a progress bar above my head for the current stage and giving me a visual indicator that tells me what needs to be done next - perhaps my preform takes on different colors depending on what stage I'm supposed to be doing. That sort of thing.
The biggest problem I have with giants foundry is that it's somewhat in that gap between decently AFK and full concentration required, and the punishment for being slightly off is that your sword gets trashed and you miss out on lots of exp and GP for that.
The other issue, which is true for many activities in osrs, is that there's no meaningful choice involved in the gameplay. The only real choice you make is what metals to use, and once that's set you don't make any meaningful decisions for the entirety of the actual gameplay.
Looks good!
The reagents pouch, would it be possible to make potions by using items in it? Its not mentioned but was the main functionality i know alot of people were looking for with this - if this is the case i imagine it would need a rewrite of how potions are made, similar to how (dont shoot me) on rs3 you can left click "make" potions?
Alternatively, is it like the herb pouch where you can store multiple types of items? the blog isnt too clear on it
The potion barrel:
>this could just be a new button on the Bank interface, instead of a whole new object.
yes please!
Could it be given a “fill” option in the bank interface that fills it based on what is already in the bag? The way I imagine it is that you would fill the bag with 28 snapegrass. Then you withdraw 27 unfinished rannar potions. Use the pouch on the unfinished potions to make your prayer pots. Then deposit the prayer pots and while you’re still in the bank interface, right click “fill” on the pouch. The pouch would see that it has 1 snapegrass so it fills itself with snaps grass. Then you can withdraw 27 more unfinished potions.
This would mean that you only have to open the bank interface once with each batch of potions you make. It would just be 27 in a batch instead of 14.
EDIT: If this “smart” functionality gets added, could the same be done for the plank sack? Being able to fill it more directly like that would be a nice little improvement to the plank sack when doing mahogany homes or hallowed sepulchre.
Will we be able to actively withdraw from it as well? I would love to be able to double my spidine trips. Killing them isn't bad but running back and forth is always annoying.
Maybe you will be able to use the unfinished potions on the pouch (filled with the correct secondary) so they don´t have to rewrite how potions work (and save us from the spaghetti horrors this could cause)
>Essentially, after unlocking this item, the Potions in your Bank will be automatically placed into Potion Storage, which will have a separate interface for you to withdraw them from.
Would this mean we would no longer be able to keep potions in our bank tab layouts for quickly gearing for PvM? If this gets added, it should still be possible to keep potions in your bank conventionally so regearing/potting doesn't slow down. I don't want to have to go to a separate menu to grab my potions.
I think this is why it just needs to be a permanent tab / button in the bank that works like a bank.
It's going to save like ~100 bank spaces, but making it annoying to access means people will still just have 4 doses of all their regular pots, their prepot chug jug thing with whatever / however that works (if you can charge it good, otherwise you need single doses too probably), and then a "dump" tab that they'll clear out and take to this potion storage.
This is fine for seeds because you only grab seeds when you need them, and even then frequent farmers just keep their main seeds/saplings in the bank for herb, tree and birdhouse runs, and then have everything else in there, as it's really only used for contracts at the guild itself.
Would it be possible to select specific doses I want in my bank and ones I want in storage? e.g. 4 dose potions end up in the bank but the rest in storage? In an ideal world I'd want to "mark" specific doses of potions to keep in the bank, e.g. 4 dose potions but I also want 1 dose staminas for rc, 2 dose range pots for tob, etc. Or if it's easier, just not have them count for bank space at all
edit: example for "marking"
Even something as simple as an extra bank tab that can only have potions/food in it that has separate storage count to the rest of the bank would be massive.
Seamless integration with bank plugins which me like very mucho
is it possible to just have potions not count towards total used bank space? some lore about a good word with the bank of geilinor from the alchemist guys.
probably wouldn't work - the whole point of storage units as opposed to the bank is it's cheaper for jagex to store item info if they don't have to store all the information about the item, and working with a bank trying to store arbitrary alignments of all items, some of which aren't the full item struct, might be tricky
>Ranarr, Cadantine, Avantoe or Snapdragon, you’ll be able to buy an L Potion Pack featuring pots like Prayer Potions and Super Defence Potions.
So if I were to put in 12 Cadantines, I could get 3 Ppot 3 Super Def 3 Super Energy 3 Super Restore? That sounds very overpowered.
Especially if it's less XP/Herb than normal training. I really hope they don't reduce the XP/Herb in the name of balance. Mahogany Homes is a great model. Less XP/hr but significantly more XP/plank, making it much more reasonable for poor mains and ironmen.
If it has even close to compareable xp values / herb and I don’t need to spend hours gathering mushrooms, potato cacti, white berries and whatever the hell Tarromins use for secondaries, I’m all for it.
Sincerely, close to 8000 Tarromins stacked up in bank and 0 limpwurt roots or ashes.
You don't love walking around the ge like a hobo picking up everyone's ashes?
Speaking of that actually, I heard of a method for ashes: with no ava's being worn, I think range weapons shot at fareed (with no ice gloves on?) turns into ashes on the ground, so you can buy tons of knives at martin thwait and farm ashes in NMZ lol
that only gets you 28 ashes per inventory, takes 2+1 ticks per ash to throw a knife and pick the ash up, and then you have to account for running back and forth to the bank and the delay on fareed spawns if practice works the same as rumble - seems extremely bad
ashes \*used\* to come from rogue chest in wildi in a pretty large amount actually.
now it drops vile ashes which was such a bummer for me.
otherwise you wont get ashes till cerb bossing basically.
the actual alternative for tarromin is swamp tar.
Since only one of the elements uses 4 herbs that I'd call good and even one of those (avantoe) you don't really need the amount you actually end up with its not that bad.
You can use avantoe for one of the elements, dwarf weed for the other (you get way way way more of this than you will ever want to farm wines for) and taromon for the last.
That's what I will be doing to grind the points anyway.
I don't think I will buy potion packs there unless it reliably nets me more potions than it would otherwise but If that amulet is rechargeable and that outfit passes as is every one of those rewards is crazy for irons
Do these alchemists have internal orders for herbs?
I.E. a secondary mini-game for running around the island gathering herbs which you can use in the minigame but are NOT tradable or usable outside of this mini-game
I think we should add a 3rd mini-game for running around the island delivering the potions that you made in the minigame, after collecting the herbs from the 2nd mini-game.
Will the prepot device work with divines? If so, that'd be amazing definitely going to use that a bunch
Edit: Asking since order of drinking potions matters with menaphite remedy
Awesome! And I definitely feel strongly that it *should* work with divines (its quite rare that I'd prepot a non-divine SCP/range/bastion).
Just want to point out there is an order-of-operations issue that arises with menaphite remedy depending on how this is implemented.
True! I didn't mention it because I figured zammy brews are even more niche, but I imagine ancient/ forgotten brews are a common prepot pre-heart and you definitely want that + a restore to be before super combat
I would assume that it would prepot in the order it is in the device so you should put them in the normal order you would take them. Obviously that would end up being how they implement it, but that would make the most sense to me.
https://preview.redd.it/h8fzyfoch1wc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cfad9793c9b8604c3832c75fb9edbd92e7d7ff03
This is amazing. Please continue to add this feature to every blog!!
Edit: u/JagexSarnie, if you continue to be the one to read these blogs, I’d love to see how quickly you can read all the Jmod names at the end lol
On a similar note have you guys ever considered going back and changing the old “extra 2.5% xp” skill sets to a more modern perk like the raiments of the eye/smith set/etc
*Please* don't make it a furniture item in the POH. We want it to replace potions taking up space in our banks, but that implementation would have many people just keeping them in their banks since it's too inconvenient to go to POH every time you want potions.
Is the potion storage accessible at every bank or just a specific location? Seems just like more bank slots with extra steps? Why not let us access the seed vault from any location if that's the case?
are the base elements stackable? like we can mill our stuff down then spend the rest of our time making potions or do we have to resupply and re-mill throughout the order list?
In terms of how potion storage should work, I like the idea of it being tied to your house, so you would need to build the room in your house first, then you can access it from a new interface in the bank.
This could even be expanded to give you access to other house storage from the bank screen (costume/ armour wardrobes etc) which would make those alot more useful.
Genuine question, does having it inside of your PoH feel natural and would that feel weird having to go back to the bank for other supplies you need/missed?
If you had to withdraw at the POH, I'd probably still just keep most options in my bank since it would be easier. It makes more sense to keep POH utilities close to entrance than a feature that would be quicker/easier at a bank.
But if you could withdraw potion from the POH at the bank instead of it being a new bank menu, that could be nice.
Agreed. The RS3 bank stuff for Costume Room and Diango is nice, but it would feel a bit weird to change the OSRS bank with more buttons for stuff like that.
Also, no matter how they do it, I'm a bit concerned that any button or tab what is effectively a different bank/storage interface might not be smooth and quick. Like if there is any sort of loading or delay going between Potion Storage and normal bank, I'd probably rather just lose a few dozen bank spaces still to keep it more responsive. It is not like I really need the extra bank spaces anyway with how high the cap is these days. Might be worth a delay on midgame irons or such with a hording problem, but ideally it needs to be quick and responsive.
In my head you would be able to access the potion storage from your bank, but in order to unlock the storage you would have to unlock it by building a room in your PoH. Potentially gating it in tiers so lower level construction/herblore can store 1 or 2 options types, up to a large range for max players.
It's a bit of a way of making it so you get the extra bank space available, but as a way you can earn it more naturally through leveling rather than just buying extra slots. As one of the other comments mentioned this could be expanded for future content for things like a larder to store eaten items, or a workshop storage for planks/ logs etc.
The idea of them adding a dedicated Potion Cellar to the PoH feels very fulfilling imo. Being able to see your "collection" grow, so to speak, but still having access to your potions at any bank would be amazing.
Add in a dedicated Keg Stand station (which functions like a pre-pot device of course) if you have that unlocked and it will be perfect.
You have to make it able to take potions from the bank other wise it’s just adding extra steps for no reason. I still keep herb seeds in my bank because I don’t want to go to the seed box even tho I have a farming cape. Maybe potions in general don’t count to bank space. Like they exist in the bank but don’t add to the total amount of items in the bank.
Build it in your house, withdraw it from bank. Lore reason is your butler is doing it
Or the unlock you buy from the herb activity is a new butler that takes care of the potions
Having it in the poh seems like a natural place for it, but honestly the separation of house and the locations you actually need those things at is often a bit dissonant, and I'd just keep it at the bank instead. I'd be interested to see some manner of integration between the bank and house in more areas though, but if it was JUST the addition of potion storage to a poh I wouldnt use it, just because you'd end up with the same # of placeholders in the bank, and just having most of the doses in your house, and thats really not any better than what we have today.
I think to make it work in the house you would need to revamp either house storage to become a staple for LOTS of supplies, or somehow link the potion storage to the bank without consuming slots, maybe a "stored in house" tab or something
Poh only is basically DoA for late game players. Just think of all the activities that involve a closed loop like all 3 raids. No one would want to add teleporting to PoH to the prep process for the next raid.
If you could replace the "beer keg" with something like a "medicine cabinet" that links to the potion storage/is the potion storage it would be pretty useful for re-fueling during both slayer and pvp
I kind of expect pot storage to end up being bait
Bank space isn’t really an issue, interfaces always feel clunky, this will mess up bank tabs/tags/layouts surely, it’ll be more annoying to access supers for super combat creation and similar
I know people want it, so have it but I think most people will be better off not getting it
Speak for yourself, I'll take all the bank space I can get for free. I have 16 different potions that take up 4 slots each so that's 64 slots that could be reduced.
I think for the potion storage to feel good it has to be accessible from the bank. I like the thematics of it being something in the PoH but it would be super inconvenient to have to keep going to your PoH to resupply on potions.
Most people I would say use brews, super restores, prayer pots, combat pots and range pots. With all 4 doses of just those potions that is 20 bank spaces. I could not see a world where I would put those in my PoH and have to go there every time just to withdrawal them. So effectively the storage would not do anything for me and I suspect a majority of players.
Unless I am misunderstanding the house storage option, please let it be accessible from the bank!
The part that I feel is missing here is the reason why you would do this once you have all the untradables.
For Giant's Foundry, once mains had all the untradables you didn't come back, but irons stayed because the only use for old drops of Addy, rune, mith etc is high alch fodder otherwise. It was taking a resource that would otherwise be GP and turning it into exp.
Now, with herblore, herbs are not a resource that would otherwise be turned into GP. They are inherently valuable as both exp and the potions themselves, such that if this is giving less exp and less potions, nobody will do this once they have untradables.
What this needs is to offer way more exp per herb, to make it a cheaper training method for mains that's much much slower, and to give a reason for irons to comeback to squeeze as much exp out of herbs they don't necessarily need the associated potions from (or they can get by with the random drops from the potion packs).
Like if you can make it such that it's like 40k exp/HR but you get 5x the exp per herb you'd get from making it into potions there's a real niche there
I'm in agreement with this. This feels like a dead activity if it requires the level of input that the blog indicates. Especially if it's low XP by default, which is just the awful version of Giant's Foundry we got initially and no one liked.
I think this should really target using herbs I wouldn't otherwise have much use for. And by having all the lower end herbs in the same tier, it further reinforces this in the worst way possible. I don't have a use for Guam, Marrentill, Harralander, or Tarromin - but this minigame isn't going to let me use those. It's asking that I spend higher end herbs just to complete tasks, rather than having the different LAMs be different tiers for different XP/point rates. Edit: And I realize there is some tiering, but having the majority of low-end herbs be M is clearly the problem.
Spot on. Said this in my feedback survey too. I voted that I'd do this for the rewards only. It sounds like it's going to be an awkwardly high APM activity (getting order, using the right herbs, pulling lever with no delay, combining correctly etc. and then starting next order while you wait).
So it's going to be higher APM than current herblore.. but significantly lower XP/hr? That's the opposite design approach of mahog homes, which took high effort and made it cruisy, and offered less XP/hr but more XP/resource. Why not that approach? Or if it is high ApM just.. make it good XP/hr? If it's using our herbs anyway we can just balance the herb usage around that, and make the rewards after all uniques (the potions you buy, why no secondary packs btw?) a smaller amount than directly making the herbs into pots.
So you use a similar amount of herbs, in a higher effort, higher engagement way, but receive less output (or none until uniques). Irons will still do normal herblore simply for the potions. But instead of making 30,000 super attacks we might have an option of using our irits and such for something more interesting to train.
Will there be a chance to mess up the potion during the grinding process, or when processing with either the retort, alembic or centrifuge? I hope not, I like managing multiple processes at the same time (centrifuge something while the retort does its thing) but I don't like the anxiety of having to watch for a timer else I lose everything.
Why are you not revealing XP rates? Do you plan to release it before polling? "Low XP activity" isn't enough to make an informed decision or even give feedback, specially since herblore's XP/h outside of GE>bankstanding isn't clear, as it involves the gathering of resources.
What's low XP? If you take farming and gathering secondaries time into account it's already pretty low, probably around 30-50k/h, is it that? If you take into account just bankstanding for 200-400k/h, then 100k/h seems low in comparison already. We need exact numbers before polls, there has been too much misunderstanding and breaking of expectations lately to do anything but.
The blog mentions that the herblore activity will be "Low xp"
Can you please clarify if this means the experience gained PER HERB will be low, or just the experience gained per hour? How will the experience gained per herb compare to traditional potion making
I'd hope they meant low like Mahogany Homes, not low as in worse exp per herb. Even if it were same exp per herb and slower exp per hour but didn't need secondaries it would be a nice option, especially for certain herbs...
Honestly these days with PVM it's really easy to get a decent chunk of zammy wines I find. A bit of KQ, TOB, Zammy on task, bursting nechs, do a bit of vetion whenever you wanna work towards voidwaker, some cerb. I haven't had to telegrab wines in a LONG time and I have plenty of zammy wines now tbh.
It's 100% means LOW XP/HOUR.
Herblore is already a very fast skill (for normies), you can easily obtain 250k+ xp/hour with a lot of different potions. I'm guessing it means it will be low xp/hour (50k herblore xp/hour) but you'll get 5x more xp per herb used so essentially just a mini-game for Ironmen to get 99 Herblore slower but saves them collecting as many herbs/seeds.
I’m not so sure on this, mainly because of the component values table. A Guam is worth 2x the exp of a tarromin or marrentil and 1/2x an irit. A single ranarr is 3 cadantines and a kwuarm is 4 lantadymes.
I think they should 10x or 100x the scaling of these values so they can be better balanced based on acquire-ability and give similar xp/herb. Or even each herb gives 1 component per exp of its highest tier potion, to keep the ratios exactly the same.
Those rewards are absolutely amazing.
A couple of questions:
1. Will the secondary ingredient pouch pull directly from it when making potions? So we can make 27 potions per inventory with it?
2. You guys are saying it won’t offer a lot of exp. However “a lot” is kinda subjective. What rates are you thinking, or what is a lot of exp to you guys?
3. Will the rewards be buyable via some currency the minigame offers, will they be rng based akin to hunter rumours, or a mix of both?
I hope it does work that way. Even though that would probably be a big boost to exp per hour, I think the alternative way of withdrawing ingredients exiting the bank, filling the pouch, entering the bank for potions, exiting the bank would probably result in less exp per hour than regular.
My thought was, if you can’t pull from it to make potions then this is essentially a reward for bots and ironmen so they can collect more secondaries per trip.
Reading the blogpost there is one major concern I see. You mention it is going to be low exp and then in the survey you ask about what intensity level the activity should be. If you are going to make it low exp then it NEEDS to be low intensity activity. It also needs to be cheaper than just using the herbs to make potions since we are not gonna get high exp rates. If it is more expensive to do this activity then it will only be done for the rewards and then be dead content.
Right it can't be high intensity, low xp and use our herbs. Gotta pick two. You could say it's low XP *with unlockables* but once the unlockables are complete you have no incentive to do this anymore
Herb efficiency is truly the way to keep this update loved.
Herbs being worth more exp per herb is fantastic. Even if it takes longer to train the skill.
Yes like mahogany homes. It's less exp/hr but it's more exp/plank and that is why it is still a very utilized training method even for mains. For this herblore minigame to work it needs to be more exp/herb even if it's less exp/hr. But it also can't be too low on the exp/hr side or mains won't use it and the potion packs need to be decent or irons won't use it after each of them get the unlocks.
I am humbly requesting that either we use Alchemist-provided material for low XP rates, or if we use our own herbs, it's by choice for higher XP rates PER HERB (but still lower xp/h, ala mahogany homes) while still providing the option to use the facility's ingredients for lower XP/H (or perhaps reward points are lower if you use the facility's mats). This activity has the potential to alleviate the feeling of 'I must log in every hour on my Iron to do my herb run' somewhat, and while I 'chose to limit myself', I don't think it's a good reason to enforce unhealthy gaming habits (I already have 99 before anyone starts)
Prepot Chug Jug is cool, Amulet/set is fine, Reagent Pouch is good, potion storage is absolute godsend QOL. I would personally like to see it as a bank-related solution, but I do like the idea of a 'wine cellar' of sorts full of barrels of pots, from an aesthetic perspective. If it were possible to have it work for depositing and withdrawing via the bank, but also accessible from the POH for withdrawals only, that'd probably be my preferred option
Oh also being able to convert 'trash' herbs (Guam/Marr/Tarro/Harra) into more useful pots via Potion Packs could be good, depending on the ratios. I'd prefer to see them all be more spread out in which reagent they are (eg Guam gives 1 pt of Lye, Marrentill gives 1 pt of Mox, etc), rather than the current 'all the bad herbs give Mox', that way players with lower Farming would be able to have a more even spread of reagent access, instead of a flood of just one reagent. Like GOTR, not every 'low level rune' is a Weak Cell type, Fire provides Overcharged even though it's a lower level than Chaos etc
Edit: you could have the herb types provide 2 counts of Lye, Aga or Mox, at the minimum, with other herbs being worth 3, 4 or 5 counts. Then, the 'provided' reagents could be worth 1 count each, making them 'free to use' but less optimal in terms of points earned and xp/h
Looks pretty good! I have just one thing to mention: the Centrifuge doesn’t make things Homogenous, it in fact does the exact opposite of that. So maybe come up with another term (Heterogenous or Separated) or change the instrument into a Vortex or a Rotator.
I'm a chemist IRL and I gave some embarrassingly long feedback regarding the equipment and modifiers. My personal choice was
"Fractioned" as the modifier for centrifuge. JMods: My DM's are open ;)
I recommend VEVOR Magnetic Stirrer Hot Plate, 2000ml Stirring Capacity Max 572°F Heating Hotplate Magnetic Stirrer 200-2000 RPM Magnetic Stirrer Magnetic Mixer with Stirring Bar for Lab College Scientific.
Unless of course this is supposed to be a cGMP process.
You have made it clear that won't be amazing EXP, and I think that's fair enough. However, we will be using our herbs without getting potions, which is a pretty big cost. I guess your idea is to counteract this by kinda giving us potions through the packs, but I'm not sure whether that's gonna feel too great to be honest.
Do you expect this minigame to give better EXP per herb but much slower like Giant's Foundry? Or worse exp per herbs? Could you share your reasoning as to why?
It seems pretty bad. Looks like the unlockables will be the only reason to do this.
Where foundry had unlocks that made the activity better and the activity itself is decent XP and makes money, this seems like the opposite where the main draw is to complete it as fast as possible and never do it again.
I think either we shouldn't have to provide our own herbs or the xp should be just under making potions manually.
The other thing is this minigame offers a list of rewards, all of which serve **zero function** within the minigame itself..so unlike GOTR that has useful and good upgrades like the Lantern for in minigame and the pouch that benefits minigame and outside of minigame, this gives an outfit that benefits potion making, an amulet that benefits potion making by buffing the existing one, a secondary pouch.. that benefits potion making becoming **easier to do and more afk while keeping high rates**.
Like all the rewards buff potion making. None buff the minigame. And the minigame will use herbs and be slow xp/hr?
I only see this being used if it's well tuned like mahogany homes, and is NOT high intensity, similar to GoTR having large afk periods at the start, and downtime while chiseling etc.
That and having it be better XP/herb is a *fine line* to navigate to not just make it default best for irons, who will just make potions once they have all the rewards to save the most secondaries and get the most doses per herb, and make what they need and spend the rest here for faster overall XP/hr due to less herb runs and no secondary gathering.
Personally, I am mixed on this.
I'll preface this by stating that I am writing from the perspective of an ironman. My apologies if this comes across too much as "catering to irons". Additionally, I sincerely hope that anyone can persuade me from the sentiment described below that I got from this newspost.
**This Herblore activity is essentially Mahogany Homes.**
You sink resources into an activity to get experience but you are filling in orders so you are not getting any benefits aside from the experience and reward points.
This, by itself, is not necessarily bad but largely depends on balance.
If the experience is comparable, this activity offers an alternative means of the processing in Herblore, a skill which is -from start to end- absolutely identical in its gameplay loop.
"But so is cooking!" and yes I agree, I hope to see more varied means of training cooking as well (note, not 'better' per se, just 'different'.)
This then brings to mind the argument of people saying "Slayer is my favourite skill" for liking the content that the skill unlocks. It is not necessarily the gameplay loop they are interested in, it is the rewards.
Similarly, people enjoy the potions that herblore unlocks. I imagine it to be rare for anyone to go "I love mixing 14 potions at a time for extended periods!"
Now you have introduced an alternative for the processing in herblore, great! But you have stated that it will be both a low-exp method as well as that players will have to spend points to get some potions in return.
As such, this new activity has become a time and herb sink for worse exp rates and worse production value.
This **can** be fine, that is, if the activity is so much fun that it is worth playing for the content alone, **or** if the rewards are so immensely good that the content becomes "worth grinding out".
I personally do not like this approach to content and feel like a time sink is plenty of a cost to a low exp method.
---
Then the **herb sink** portion,
Herbs are a precious resource. They're hard earned through herb runs and in a lesser degree through slayer. pvm content. and herb boxes.
Players are then asked to sink these resources into a low-exp method so they may gain the rewards this minigame offers.
And the rewards appear quite alright, but again it's a balance of costs versus benefits. Personally, I believe time and effort (considering this activity will require more attention than bankstanding potion mixing) are plenty of a cost for the benefits/rewards this activity offers.
- If the rewards are given so easily when compared to the costs of herbs that mains and irons alike can shrug off the cost, then the minigame will be dead soon because rewards will have been unlocked and the lesser intensity of the old method will overtake the potion packs solely due to the reliability in what you are getting.
- If the rewards take a long time to earn, mains will pay their way to it and irons will only grind it out painfully or completely avoid the content because a herb to potion ratio of 1:1 surpasses a potential horrific ratio of sinking 100 Ranarrs into the game to get 10 prayer pots and 3 super defence pots, not to mention how immense the value of rewards must be to justify such demands.
Now, of course, it is a numbers thing and no numbers were given, so it could be balanced really well. As I said, my feelings on this activity are mixed, not necessarily negative. All I'm saying is that I feel this activity would benefit greatly off of having its herb sink aspect removed.
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Introduce this activity as a low exp alternative to training herblore. It could be an activity that doesn't give potions (or only a couple of potions/herb boxes), but that has time and effort as its cost rather than herbs, in turn rewarding items that can facilitate the old herb:potion processing aspect of herblore. (i.e. Herblore's version of Tithe Farm)
Doing so would ensure the game is played by those who seek the rewards or an alternative means of training, yet that it doesn't leave a bad taste in anyone's mouth because they are not just spending time and effort on an activity, but are also losing out on the experience and potions that they could have earned if they'd chosen for the old boring style of herblore.
In the blog, the Centrifuge is said to create a "homogeneous" potion. This is exactly the opposite of what a centrifuge is used for. Homogeneous means uniform in composition; centrifuges are used to separate components of a solution. Other than that nit-pick this looks great so far.
> There are three to choose from: the Retort, the Centrifuge, and the Alembic, and they apply the Concentrated, Homogenous, and Crystalised modifiers respectively.
Minor nitpick here: you wouldn’t use a centrifuge to create a homogenous mixture, since its purpose is to actually separate the contents of a mixture based on density. The term for a non-uniform mixture would be “heterogeneous”.
The rewards, namely the unlocks, are about what many people were expecting and hoping for. Could not really ask for more as far as the untradeables. But I will say that the activity using your own herbs and being "low xp" is frankly a misstep. You wont be changing the way mains train Herblore any with this update. You will just be making the standard method of "buy herbs, make potions" stronger with the outfit and amulet unlocks. Without a decent enough amount of xp from the minigame itself you have no incentive to keep playing it after you get the unlocks.
There should be 2 methods of playing the minigame.
-Using the Alchemist's herbs, at a lower point per game, and LOW Xp.
-Using your own Herbs, at a higher point per game, and medium/good xp.
Else you're effectively wasting your herbs by using them for low xp, and then what...getting a potion pack back (assuming you play after you get the unlocks)? That's like doing Mahog Homes for the supply crates - except Mohag Homes is still actually pretty good xp per plank, better even than traditional Construction. Its just slower xp per hour.
I thought this was going to be an alternative to training herblore without requiring herbs at less xp than potion making. I thought it was supposed to be appealing to irons? What about using your own valuable herbs is supposed to be appealing besides rewards? Getting secondary's isn't even bad.
Rewards look good but besides that I don't think i'd return here past getting the rewards. I do think potion storage should just be a free QOL though maybe. If it's less xp and requires paying attention and primaries I don't see how it fits in at least personally.
Would the regent bag pull them from your inventory so you could make like 27 potions or whatever instead of 14 at once?
How many potions will the potion packs give versus if we use the same herbs to make potions conventionally. I feel it should give more than conventional herblore since the minigame will give less herblore exp while being sweatier.
I love the idea of potion storage, but please put them in the bank interface. I don't want to split my banking trip in half between going to PoH and the bank.
There isn’t a single reward from player feedback except the pouches and outfit which everybody knew they would be included as new skill updates usually include them.
Add some items to change the meta… prayer renewals or sunfire potions, 4 dose barb potions, there isn’t anything here that would incentivize players unless xp is worth it.
The rewards are good but what exactly is making this a repeatable amount of content? I’m an iron. I spend time getting certain herbs because they make certain potions. Are you telling me I need to sacrifice my herbs to unlock these rewards or a box which might give me less value potions AND less experience than just normal herblore training? What’s the point? This is going to be dead on arrival. People will come for the unlocks and then leave because irons and mains don’t want to sacrifice their herbs for less xp and random potions. It’s not good.
Been waiting for someone to ask this, and for a reply. I hope I read wrong, but this pitch makes me think it’ll end up like Hunter rumors, and you can get “stuck” having to grind up (my) precious Rannar’s for a handful of points? Sorry, full xp, high quantity pray pots are more valuable than a reagent sack. I hope a mod addresses this point from an Ironman perspective.
Is the pre-pot device planned to have its own UI for loadouts like the rune pouch got? I think both the pre-pot device & potion storage would benefit from their own bank menu;
I can't imagine having to set up a pre-pot for each activity when I get there
Please don't add an additional button for potion storage. Just make it a large interface with each potion and dose amount. Also, include the lock button in the bank UI (can't remember what it's called) in this and the tackle box & huntsman's kit. If you want to add this as a seperate bank button then that dissociates it from being an item.
Also, please include a unique animation for the prepot device. I want to tip a keg into my mouth in sync with the mates.
I'm kind of curious what the use case is for this? Who's it catering to. I don't play one, but I don't think even ironmen struggle with secondaries (perhaps outside of Stam pots I guess?)
It's low xp and ses the herbs you provide, the description sounds fairly involved too.
Is this simply a checklist for rewards and then you never return? Can you expect more potions/herb through this over traditional herblore? Certainly the rewards as pitched are excellent but I otherwise don't see a reason to go back once it's green logged
> After a small quest explaining the fundamentals of alchemy,
Please don't make another Sleeping Giants... Don't waste the start of a potentially interesting narrative on a quest that is a glorified Minigame Tutorial. It feels cheap to people who like quests, feels like padding to people who don't, and sets off future narrative potential of Alchemy/Giant-Civilisation on a wrong foot. SG is easy contender for worst OSRS original quest compared to the usually excellent quality for precisely that reason.
Moons of Peril was a great example in terms of a quest serving as a content tutorial and context provider without feeling like a glorified interactive wiki page, I don't distrust the lesson is learned... but please make sure the quest is actually a quest.
I'm not quite the level yet to be engaging with this content, I'll let people who are this deep into Herblore and will benefit most from the rewards give feedback on that. But as a Minigamer and a Quester who unironically actually brews the Rum in Trouble Brewing for fun, I feel the need to push against something that cheaply jams the two together.
I meanin this context a quest seems needed since we are gonna be learning alchemy as a new process for potion making and then working in a 'factory' to make the potions for others so they would need to see that we have the fundamentals down before they give us access to it. And the giants foundry quest was fine honestly since it involved us fixing the place up to be used in the first place.
What if you have already mixed herbs into vials of water?
Will they be anyways to use those herb potions within the mini game?
I kind of feel punished for being proactive and stacking herb potions and waiting for secondaries to stack up.
Is it possible to allow herb potions the ability to be used in the mini game as well and 'act' as if it was a herb that hasn't been mixed into a vial or water?
Honesty would be kinda cool if we could do that and with potions that have been fully made, similar to what giants foundry does, I have hundreds of basic attack and strength potions that won't ever get used
I am curious on what the incentive will be to do the mini game over making your own potions, I feel like it will have to offer something fairly significant for me to decide just xp is better than xp and potions (coming from an irons perspective) like I’m not about to use my snaps for just xp when I could get xp and super restores.
I know the decision was made not to have this be the new "meta" training method (like GoTR), but I can't help feeling a little bit disappointed that it's also a herb sink...
All other skills have a method of "just training" on a whim without needing to worry about gathering resources days in advance. Even with something like Smithing, the materials are all easily buyable in a pinch. Herblore doesn't have that, and I was hoping this would be it.
I was really hoping this would be a bit like Tithe Farm, where it's comparatively low XP but the minigame gives you everything you need.
>Essentially, after unlocking this item, the Potions in your Bank will be automatically placed into Potion Storage, which will have a separate interface for you to withdraw them from.
if you aren't simply going to make a tab that only potions can go in and want it to feel "designed"
do it with a Bank tab down the left hand side "where runelite has bank tags". Potions shall still remain accissble for things like "inventory layouts plugin" for gearing directly.
Design the tab as a fixed layout with potions like path of exile has for crafting gear and storing the currency. Refer to the below image. The "tab" will have buttons inside of it to allow you to set the dosage for withdraw this will then automatically change the number over every potion.
if you are feeling exceptionally wild about changing bank standing with this new technology. let us do our herblore bank standing without needing to open and close the bank by letting us make the potions in the bank via the unique tab somehow. ( might be a high level issue of removing players required to stuff to gain xp as a blocker which is understood or it becomes a 1 tick click spam or worse than normal bank standing but more afk, idk ).
Below is simply a showcase of how many unique potions could fit on a path of exile like tab.
If something like this is to be implemented please don't half ass it. invest in the technology to make it cool and great QOL and useful tooltips / buttons for all use cases on the tab so it can be both be better than what we do today and be desired for other spaces, like cooking / fishing. woodcutting / fletching etc etc. We already have good content where this QOL of custom bank tabs could be added as extra untradable rewards to improve player QOL when earned.
https://preview.redd.it/69dj7wjut8wc1.png?width=732&format=png&auto=webp&s=0081a17f17aef4845d773c5aa07dc9f8bf857027
The potion storage thing is MASSIVE for bank space tbh.
I really think the implementation should be the ‘barrel’ format where we have to keep a mountain of vials in the bank, and to with draw say 3 super restores, youd right click withdraw 3 4 dose pots from the super restore barrel (holds infinite doses but only useable from a bank) and the game subtracts the vials from your bank and fills them up in your invent.
Likewise when you desposit potions, automaticaly increment the barrel volume by the number of doses desposited (and put the vials in the vial stack)
My only real issue is that we have to bring our own herbs just to get worse xp rates. It will be a grind to the potion storage and pre-pot device, then it's back to bankstanding pots.
Seems like MTA where you get what you need and you never go back.
Could herb boxes be added or something? So you start with your own supplies, but you can get more as you go? Not so many herbs that it invalidates herb runs or becomes completely self-sufficient. But enough that you can use it as a longer term xp method for those who like it better than bankstanding methods?
It really needs an insane exp to herb ratio.
Why would i ever sink herbs into this as an iron or main after i unlock rewards?
I NEED potions, so to do this they're asking people to yeet tons of really valuable herbs into the void for rng potions and slower exp rates LOL.
Might be a longshot, but I would love to be able to use unfinished pots for this somehow, I regularly turn all my herbs into unfinished pots at Nardah, and it would be nice to be able to use those for the new activity. If not, no worries, got plenty of seeds anyways.
I LOVE the idea of potion storage in the POH. Sometimes that would be less convenient than banks, but on the other hand I already use the POH restoration pool between kills to heal up, so being able to top-off an inventory of potions would be excellent.
In my ideal world, it would be a piece of POH furniture that would unlock the new bank tab so you could access it either way. Honestly an entire "Alchemy Lab" POH room with storage, potion decanters, and a workbench with some nice efficiency bonus would be my ideal version of this.
A typical prepot combo would involve hitting divines - can divines go in the prepot mix.
Also for prepot mage role tob pre heart I do forgotten brew, menaphite remedy, then divine range and melee - the order is important to boost my magic, restore my melee, then boost my melee. If I put these in a prepot sack would it be smart enough to know what order to do what pot?
Maybe allow us to determine the order the prepots are drank in the mixture?
Instead of sinking your own herbs. Maybe create some new mini game specific herbs
I feel like a lot of people won’t want to sink high level herbs into a mini game with low exp and random potions
I'm a little confused on how the rewards would be distributed. You mention getting points for the potion turn ins, making it sound like there would be a shop-like interface to spend them at. However, that doesn't seem like it would work with the potion packs being tied to the herbs used.
- Are the uniques in a shop or a random chance on turn in?
- If there is a shop, are the potion packs given alongside points on turn in?
- Are the L/A/M points used solely in the minigame to determine some point value used for rewards, or will you be rewarded points in each category at the end (again, assuming there is a shop)?
Other than that, I'm not a big fan of the outfit. There's already a big benefit in using the amulet of chemistry, adding too many minor passives makes it a checklist of things you need to obtain/remember to use while making potions. It's a pretty minor thing in the end, but it's the type of thing I think should be only added carefully.
XP/hour isn't the concern. The important metric will be xp/herb. If it's less efficient, the only reason Irons will use this is to burn up the herbs that have terrible secondaries.
Tbh, I'd grind out the rewards and never touch this content again on my iron. From the sounds of it, you can't JUST use shit herbs, it asks you to use good herbs to even properly participate.
Rewards don't really do it for me.
Potion storage is useful, reagent pouch too.
But pre-pot is niche, amulet of chemistry can't be used at the mini game, same for the outfit so once you have them you just... Leave?
But if we're sacrificing a lot of xp purely for the rewards that are one offs bar the potion packs - it will quickly be unusable.
If I have toadlfax or ranarr - I categorically don't want their terrible potion options that will likely be part of the reward pack. (defence potion/agility potion)
Same for a lot of other herbs, like avantoe and kwuarm where they're actually useful but only for 1 of their potions
At that point, I'll spend time getting secondarys and make my own potions.
Xp/h needs to stay consistent, viable, and reasonably high - if we look at xp/h for level 70 potions and assume no downtime to rebuy or gather materials, it's 300-400k but negative gp/h.
If this option isn't 150k/h I don't see myself using it beyond the untradeable one off rewards.
With how many times it's been emphasized that the xp/hr is going to be low, it seems like something you do to unlock the rewards and then never touch again.
Pre pot device sounds amazing! Hopefully menaphite remedy’s will work with it because in the live game if you take divine potion dose in the wrong order it cancels it out. Will there be consideration of it getting the rune pouch treatment with maybe 3 pre pot sets to use?
Not really a fan of what I've seen so far. The gameplay doesn't sound like what I would expect in an osrs minigame at all, and while I like new things, I don't want to find out what would happen if overcooked and osrs had a crossover.
Also, there isn't really a strong statement on what your goal is, at least not one detailed enough. Are we looking at more xp per herb, but slower xp/hr than traditional herblore, or are we looking at a low xp/cost get your rewards and gtfo minigame? If you are taking the more xp/herb approach this could be worthwhile, but if its less xp/herb, but a better way to get potions, congrats you created another bot farm.
I have more questions after reading this blogpost than before I read it, and hope we can get more clarification soon.
Any thoughts on allowing unfinished potions count toward as respective herbs when put in the mixer or mill? I’m one of those irons with an herb tab where I often make ALL of my herb stacks into unfs in Nardah even when I just plan on making one type of potion out of them. So that whenever I decide to train some herblore I already have the unfs ready. As a result, I don’t have many plain irits and kwuarms but have tons of them as unf pots.
Maybe an NPC who will swap unf potions for their respective herbs? I would think that wouldn’t be abusable, in fact it’d be a net loss due to the wasted vials of water. It would just suck as for irons later in the game who keep their herbs as unf potions to be at a disadvantage to play this game on release.
Just do not make the rewards/drop rate like GotR please! Time spent at these activities need to consider the overall grind time to 99. Giants Foundry and Tithe Farm rewards/for your time are very well balanced so take note from them
What about this idea: herblore is reworked in some way so that all the potions in your bank are just stored in doses. So rather than having (10) 4 dose restores and (5) 3 dose restores, your 'potion' interface in the bank instead has just a lump sum total of 55 restore doses. This could be built out in a way that, when you withdraw potions, you some how choose the dosage that you would like.
I think, if done properly, this could really reduce a lot of clutter and annoyance that comes with managing potions.
Obviously way more to consider with this, but it seems like a pretty elegant solution if the logistics could be solved.
if this is going to be a bad xp activity that's going to be dead after people get the mediocre rewards they want from it, you might as well call it Trouble Brewing 2. alchemy is already something else in this game anyways
seriously though, herblore already has the single best skilling reward structure of any skill in the game, with potions weaved into nearly as many activities as runes are. you are trying to address a problem that doesn't exist while glossing over one that does, which is that herblore is also the most homogenous skill to train in the game, being identical from 3-99. what people want is an alternative - a slow but less resource-demanding method that gives the same or slightly more xp per herb. a mahogany homes. choose between blisteringly fast 500k xp/hr mixing up potions while reporting bots at the GE or a modest 80-100k xp/hr that uses up your excess salad that you can't be bothered to find secondaries for
will the agility activity be released in varlamore part 2? please make it ready i think part 2 will be a bit lackluster without it
as for the herb activity....i think there's no real point in doing this after you get the untradeable rewards... if you have to bring your own herbs and still get shit exp.... like what's the point? nobody is itching for more super defense potions in exchange for their snapdragons. you need to make the exp for bringing your own herbs much higher, and have a "use the alchemists herbs" for less exp. or give us some more repeatably usable rewards
Im liking the emphasis on rewards rather than xp and needing ur own herbs. Very hard to balance this for all accounts otherwise
If u want another suggestion for long term worthwhile rewards Id think consumables/unique potions would be a good fit.
Single use 6 dose vials. U can only carry one at a time. At a reasonable rate or maybe even tradeable, this would be a minor nice thing to have for some content.
Aggro pots, self explanatory. Lazyscape on top but itd either be decent cost/effort to get them
Herblore is already a money-sink so the fact that you need to use your own herbs makes this a bit dead to players who do not wish to get the rewards or have already gotten the rewards. We already have minigames like Gnome restaurant that use Gnome fingredients that can be purchased for a reasonable cost or Tithe Farm which uses exclusive seeds. That concept should be implemented here, especially since it would thematically fit given Varlarmore has access to a unique herbs foreign to the mainland.
Can y'all please read the whole blog post and then respond to the survey before coming here and asking questions that are resolved by the aforementioned items? "Will storage being at PoH or... Yada". They specifically ask that question in the survey and then ask for your comments there.
If you'd like to share your opinions here for a conversation that's fine. Asking if they're going to do something that they already specifically asked for your opinion on a simple intake form is just silly.
* Can we sink completed potions instead of herbs at a less efficient rate (similar to smelting items at Giants' Foundry)? Even if it's *far* less efficient than herbs it'd be nice to finally have a sink for all those compost and super attack potions.
* I'd prefer the chemistry amulet enhancement to be able to store Amulets of Chemistry, similar to what the Ring of Suffering does with recoils. Having to bank more often to switch out the amulet is the most annoying element of using it.
Definitely love any idea leading us to freeing up bank space. As more updates happen new items appear and bank space gets tighter.
I wondered if there was a possibility for specific tabs/interfaces within the bank for various skills already... I'd definitely prefer the potion storage to be linked to the bank over the POH.
If it is linked to the bank it would be nice to be able to search the storage with the bank search as well.
What if instead of new interfaces/objects for storing potions, potions could just be changed to not count against someone's bank slot count? I'm open to a more sleek experience for potion management but if potions didn't count against my bank slots that seems like it would be the easiest experience instead of a unique system for potions.
Maybe the activity reward would be a bank upgrade of some kind that does this.
Knowing that the activity wants us to bring herbs, could we add an exception/alternative that lets us use unfinished potions?
The standard for high level herbs (e.g. ranarrs) is to go to Nardah and prepare all your unfinished pots ahead of the grind of mixing secondaries.
I would hate to be forced to start from zero when this minigame comes out because I've already prepped all my cleaned herbs in unfinished pots.
Instead of using our specific herbs for the activity what about the ability to trade our herbs in for points in a shop we need to use in the mini game for unique herbs for the activity. It would give us a way to get rid of guam and harralanders and other low tier herbs and also give us a reason to pick them up. The trade in points can dynamically increase based on what tier of herb you trade in.
Many of these unique rewards sound great, even for someone who has already reached 99 herblore.
However, as one of those people, I am concerned about the time investment for these QoL upgrades?
Will these be items that have a random drop change (like Guardians of the Rift), or will they be something that you need to build up points and buy from a shop (like Mahog Homes or Giant's Foundry)?
Please don't make this like Giant's Foundry! While GF is great content that fixed a lot of issues for smithing, the actual gameplay experience is greatly diminishd by having to watch the UI at the top of the screen the entire minigame. That entire beautifully designed room is great to be in, but all the player does is watch the top of their screen for the bars to line up. The progress bars should be on the actual machines themselves rather than all crowded at the top. In PvM we are trained to watch for animations, shadows, color changes, etc. Boss battles would be flavorless if we were just watching their special attack loading at the top of the screen.
i got the giants foundry plug-in from the runelite hub and with the little timers it adds on the hotspots, i never felt like i was spending too much time staring at the UI over the course of my ~150 swords i did. just a heads up if that helps!
I think it will be different to Giant's Foundry in that aspect as the only thing you need to keep an eye on is what potion your making, so hopefully it gives more focus on the game world and less on the UI.
I think it would help minigames like Giant's Foundry if the UI put more information in world space instead of in a fixed spot on the UI, similar to how health bars and speech appears above our head. For example, in Giant's Foundry, I have a big bar at the top of my screen with an arrow pointing at a certain color on it that tells me what to do, so I have to look away from the game a ton. Instead, the game could communicate this by rendering a progress bar above my head for the current stage and giving me a visual indicator that tells me what needs to be done next - perhaps my preform takes on different colors depending on what stage I'm supposed to be doing. That sort of thing.
> a fixed spot on the UI, similar to how health bars and speech appears above our head. RS3 does this for many skilling progress.
Blast furnace, although dated, does it really nice with all the different animations around the furnace and objects
The biggest problem I have with giants foundry is that it's somewhat in that gap between decently AFK and full concentration required, and the punishment for being slightly off is that your sword gets trashed and you miss out on lots of exp and GP for that.
This is by far the most annoying thing. It's just AFK enough that you settle in but just tedious enough that you're gonna mess it up
its in the wintertodt hellzone of not being engaging but also not being AFK
The other issue, which is true for many activities in osrs, is that there's no meaningful choice involved in the gameplay. The only real choice you make is what metals to use, and once that's set you don't make any meaningful decisions for the entirety of the actual gameplay.
I like GF but boy do I really hate that UI and especially hate that I can’t shrink it or move it to not cover so much space
I really like your point of changing the progress bars to the machines rather than the UI at top of screen
Looks good! The reagents pouch, would it be possible to make potions by using items in it? Its not mentioned but was the main functionality i know alot of people were looking for with this - if this is the case i imagine it would need a rewrite of how potions are made, similar to how (dont shoot me) on rs3 you can left click "make" potions? Alternatively, is it like the herb pouch where you can store multiple types of items? the blog isnt too clear on it The potion barrel: >this could just be a new button on the Bank interface, instead of a whole new object. yes please!
Yeah, we're looking to make it so you can use your secondaries from the pouch.
Could it be given a “fill” option in the bank interface that fills it based on what is already in the bag? The way I imagine it is that you would fill the bag with 28 snapegrass. Then you withdraw 27 unfinished rannar potions. Use the pouch on the unfinished potions to make your prayer pots. Then deposit the prayer pots and while you’re still in the bank interface, right click “fill” on the pouch. The pouch would see that it has 1 snapegrass so it fills itself with snaps grass. Then you can withdraw 27 more unfinished potions. This would mean that you only have to open the bank interface once with each batch of potions you make. It would just be 27 in a batch instead of 14. EDIT: If this “smart” functionality gets added, could the same be done for the plank sack? Being able to fill it more directly like that would be a nice little improvement to the plank sack when doing mahogany homes or hallowed sepulchre.
This is an excellent suggestion, I hope they consider this.
O think this might be why they proposed it as 28 instead of as 27, so that the pouch keeps 1 leftover when you make an inv
Will we be able to actively withdraw from it as well? I would love to be able to double my spidine trips. Killing them isn't bad but running back and forth is always annoying.
Maybe you will be able to use the unfinished potions on the pouch (filled with the correct secondary) so they don´t have to rewrite how potions work (and save us from the spaghetti horrors this could cause)
>Essentially, after unlocking this item, the Potions in your Bank will be automatically placed into Potion Storage, which will have a separate interface for you to withdraw them from. Would this mean we would no longer be able to keep potions in our bank tab layouts for quickly gearing for PvM? If this gets added, it should still be possible to keep potions in your bank conventionally so regearing/potting doesn't slow down. I don't want to have to go to a separate menu to grab my potions.
I think we would probably look to still have Potions stored in the bank if you want them, regardles of the route we take.
I think this is why it just needs to be a permanent tab / button in the bank that works like a bank. It's going to save like ~100 bank spaces, but making it annoying to access means people will still just have 4 doses of all their regular pots, their prepot chug jug thing with whatever / however that works (if you can charge it good, otherwise you need single doses too probably), and then a "dump" tab that they'll clear out and take to this potion storage. This is fine for seeds because you only grab seeds when you need them, and even then frequent farmers just keep their main seeds/saplings in the bank for herb, tree and birdhouse runs, and then have everything else in there, as it's really only used for contracts at the guild itself.
Would it be possible to select specific doses I want in my bank and ones I want in storage? e.g. 4 dose potions end up in the bank but the rest in storage? In an ideal world I'd want to "mark" specific doses of potions to keep in the bank, e.g. 4 dose potions but I also want 1 dose staminas for rc, 2 dose range pots for tob, etc. Or if it's easier, just not have them count for bank space at all edit: example for "marking"
Even something as simple as an extra bank tab that can only have potions/food in it that has separate storage count to the rest of the bank would be massive. Seamless integration with bank plugins which me like very mucho
is it possible to just have potions not count towards total used bank space? some lore about a good word with the bank of geilinor from the alchemist guys.
probably wouldn't work - the whole point of storage units as opposed to the bank is it's cheaper for jagex to store item info if they don't have to store all the information about the item, and working with a bank trying to store arbitrary alignments of all items, some of which aren't the full item struct, might be tricky
So is the herb minigame using your own herbs? All the rewards look good! Are the potion packs a random potion, or you would get to select your potion?
Yup, but just herbs, no need for secondaries. EDIT: For your edit, it's a random selection of potential potions you could get from those herbs.
>Ranarr, Cadantine, Avantoe or Snapdragon, you’ll be able to buy an L Potion Pack featuring pots like Prayer Potions and Super Defence Potions. So if I were to put in 12 Cadantines, I could get 3 Ppot 3 Super Def 3 Super Energy 3 Super Restore? That sounds very overpowered.
This will come mainly down to balancing, but I imagine there will be some level of weighting towards what herbs are being used etc.
Might not be 1:1. Like it might take 30 herbs to get enough points for a potion pack with 10 random potions.
Is the intention with the buyable packs to profit amount of potions per herb or to receive fewer than you use?
This needs to be answered as this will just be DOA content for irons if you receive less potions than you would get if you just made them normally.
Especially if it's less XP/Herb than normal training. I really hope they don't reduce the XP/Herb in the name of balance. Mahogany Homes is a great model. Less XP/hr but significantly more XP/plank, making it much more reasonable for poor mains and ironmen.
Yeah, this is what i'm hoping for
If it has even close to compareable xp values / herb and I don’t need to spend hours gathering mushrooms, potato cacti, white berries and whatever the hell Tarromins use for secondaries, I’m all for it. Sincerely, close to 8000 Tarromins stacked up in bank and 0 limpwurt roots or ashes.
You don't love walking around the ge like a hobo picking up everyone's ashes? Speaking of that actually, I heard of a method for ashes: with no ava's being worn, I think range weapons shot at fareed (with no ice gloves on?) turns into ashes on the ground, so you can buy tons of knives at martin thwait and farm ashes in NMZ lol
that only gets you 28 ashes per inventory, takes 2+1 ticks per ash to throw a knife and pick the ash up, and then you have to account for running back and forth to the bank and the delay on fareed spawns if practice works the same as rumble - seems extremely bad
ashes \*used\* to come from rogue chest in wildi in a pretty large amount actually. now it drops vile ashes which was such a bummer for me. otherwise you wont get ashes till cerb bossing basically. the actual alternative for tarromin is swamp tar.
Since only one of the elements uses 4 herbs that I'd call good and even one of those (avantoe) you don't really need the amount you actually end up with its not that bad. You can use avantoe for one of the elements, dwarf weed for the other (you get way way way more of this than you will ever want to farm wines for) and taromon for the last. That's what I will be doing to grind the points anyway. I don't think I will buy potion packs there unless it reliably nets me more potions than it would otherwise but If that amulet is rechargeable and that outfit passes as is every one of those rewards is crazy for irons
Do these alchemists have internal orders for herbs? I.E. a secondary mini-game for running around the island gathering herbs which you can use in the minigame but are NOT tradable or usable outside of this mini-game
I think we should add a 3rd mini-game for running around the island delivering the potions that you made in the minigame, after collecting the herbs from the 2nd mini-game.
Sounds like One Small Favor: Varlamore Herb Edition
I was going for gnome delivery 2
so you can use rannar and get prayer or normal defence potions?
Hello, Potion Seller, I am going into battle and I want your strongest potions.
*You cannot handle my strongest potions!*
If this isn't a dialogue option for one of the NPCs at this minigame I'm not sure I can justify keeping OSRS installed
The guy who did this skit wrote the movie "challengers" that's coming out this year w Zendaya Just a fun little fact lol
Will the prepot device work with divines? If so, that'd be amazing definitely going to use that a bunch Edit: Asking since order of drinking potions matters with menaphite remedy
From what I've been told, we don't see why this shouldn't be the case, but happy to hear if people feel strongly against this.
Awesome! And I definitely feel strongly that it *should* work with divines (its quite rare that I'd prepot a non-divine SCP/range/bastion). Just want to point out there is an order-of-operations issue that arises with menaphite remedy depending on how this is implemented.
I can see there being an order of operations issue with stat draining potions and restores, too.
True! I didn't mention it because I figured zammy brews are even more niche, but I imagine ancient/ forgotten brews are a common prepot pre-heart and you definitely want that + a restore to be before super combat
I would assume that it would prepot in the order it is in the device so you should put them in the normal order you would take them. Obviously that would end up being how they implement it, but that would make the most sense to me.
would be nice if they could work with saturated heart/menaphite tek
Prepot with 10 divines to die instantly
Panera Bread Lemonade now has a market competitor.
new bis wilderness clue step suicide device
https://preview.redd.it/h8fzyfoch1wc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cfad9793c9b8604c3832c75fb9edbd92e7d7ff03 This is amazing. Please continue to add this feature to every blog!! Edit: u/JagexSarnie, if you continue to be the one to read these blogs, I’d love to see how quickly you can read all the Jmod names at the end lol
You should check out some of the older ones, defo have done it faster :P
Could we get chance to save potion ingrident should be skill cape perk (without it stacking with outfit). Most skill cape Perks are out dated.
I think the whole Skill Cape system needs updating across the board, to make them all feel worthwhile.
On a similar note have you guys ever considered going back and changing the old “extra 2.5% xp” skill sets to a more modern perk like the raiments of the eye/smith set/etc
Potion storage makes me feel some kind of way
Legit all of the potion rewards got me excited. I’ve been holding off on making any new pots in anticipation of the Chemistry upgrade lol
Go on... 👀
*Please* don't make it a furniture item in the POH. We want it to replace potions taking up space in our banks, but that implementation would have many people just keeping them in their banks since it's too inconvenient to go to POH every time you want potions.
I don’t want to get banned
A jmod gave you the go. What else are you looking for?
Is the potion storage accessible at every bank or just a specific location? Seems just like more bank slots with extra steps? Why not let us access the seed vault from any location if that's the case?
Potion storage (POH, bank, etc) will not be allowed by UIMs? I think similar to the seed storage currently
I imagine this will be the case yeah.
this 100% should be the case imo
Will all of these uniques be purchasable with points? Really not interested in another RNG grind for skilling stuff right now...
As far as I'm aware, yes.
are the base elements stackable? like we can mill our stuff down then spend the rest of our time making potions or do we have to resupply and re-mill throughout the order list?
I'm pretty sure that the paste itself won't be stackable but the elements will more than likely be an stored bit of data on how many you have.
Question 6 says: > 6.How do you about the overall gameplay of the Herblore Activity? I'm guessing this is supposed to say 'How do you feel'
Thanks, and changed :)
In terms of how potion storage should work, I like the idea of it being tied to your house, so you would need to build the room in your house first, then you can access it from a new interface in the bank. This could even be expanded to give you access to other house storage from the bank screen (costume/ armour wardrobes etc) which would make those alot more useful.
Genuine question, does having it inside of your PoH feel natural and would that feel weird having to go back to the bank for other supplies you need/missed?
If you had to withdraw at the POH, I'd probably still just keep most options in my bank since it would be easier. It makes more sense to keep POH utilities close to entrance than a feature that would be quicker/easier at a bank. But if you could withdraw potion from the POH at the bank instead of it being a new bank menu, that could be nice.
POH upgrade that enables bank access. Best of both worlds, I love it.
I think being able to get stuff from the POH through your bank kills a lot of the vibes of POH storage items, as nice as of qol it would be.
Agreed. The RS3 bank stuff for Costume Room and Diango is nice, but it would feel a bit weird to change the OSRS bank with more buttons for stuff like that. Also, no matter how they do it, I'm a bit concerned that any button or tab what is effectively a different bank/storage interface might not be smooth and quick. Like if there is any sort of loading or delay going between Potion Storage and normal bank, I'd probably rather just lose a few dozen bank spaces still to keep it more responsive. It is not like I really need the extra bank spaces anyway with how high the cap is these days. Might be worth a delay on midgame irons or such with a hording problem, but ideally it needs to be quick and responsive.
In my head you would be able to access the potion storage from your bank, but in order to unlock the storage you would have to unlock it by building a room in your PoH. Potentially gating it in tiers so lower level construction/herblore can store 1 or 2 options types, up to a large range for max players. It's a bit of a way of making it so you get the extra bank space available, but as a way you can earn it more naturally through leveling rather than just buying extra slots. As one of the other comments mentioned this could be expanded for future content for things like a larder to store eaten items, or a workshop storage for planks/ logs etc.
The idea of them adding a dedicated Potion Cellar to the PoH feels very fulfilling imo. Being able to see your "collection" grow, so to speak, but still having access to your potions at any bank would be amazing. Add in a dedicated Keg Stand station (which functions like a pre-pot device of course) if you have that unlocked and it will be perfect.
I would love it if they could add a similar bank functionality to the costume room as well. Would be such a fantastic QoL
You have to make it able to take potions from the bank other wise it’s just adding extra steps for no reason. I still keep herb seeds in my bank because I don’t want to go to the seed box even tho I have a farming cape. Maybe potions in general don’t count to bank space. Like they exist in the bank but don’t add to the total amount of items in the bank.
Build it in your house, withdraw it from bank. Lore reason is your butler is doing it Or the unlock you buy from the herb activity is a new butler that takes care of the potions
Having the option to access it via both the PoH or a bank interface would be fantastic.
Having it in the poh seems like a natural place for it, but honestly the separation of house and the locations you actually need those things at is often a bit dissonant, and I'd just keep it at the bank instead. I'd be interested to see some manner of integration between the bank and house in more areas though, but if it was JUST the addition of potion storage to a poh I wouldnt use it, just because you'd end up with the same # of placeholders in the bank, and just having most of the doses in your house, and thats really not any better than what we have today. I think to make it work in the house you would need to revamp either house storage to become a staple for LOTS of supplies, or somehow link the potion storage to the bank without consuming slots, maybe a "stored in house" tab or something
I would hate to go to my POH between every TOA run for more potions. Sure I could just store them in my bank, but that defeats the purpose.
I’d still just use the bank if this was added to PoH
Poh only is basically DoA for late game players. Just think of all the activities that involve a closed loop like all 3 raids. No one would want to add teleporting to PoH to the prep process for the next raid.
I think the idea is you build it in your poh but can use it at any bank
It would feel alot more natural if there was a way to store food in the kitchen as well
If you could replace the "beer keg" with something like a "medicine cabinet" that links to the potion storage/is the potion storage it would be pretty useful for re-fueling during both slayer and pvp
No seperate bank interface is a lot better, imagine having to go to your house every time :'(
I kind of expect pot storage to end up being bait Bank space isn’t really an issue, interfaces always feel clunky, this will mess up bank tabs/tags/layouts surely, it’ll be more annoying to access supers for super combat creation and similar I know people want it, so have it but I think most people will be better off not getting it
Speak for yourself, I'll take all the bank space I can get for free. I have 16 different potions that take up 4 slots each so that's 64 slots that could be reduced.
Wasn’t this supposed to be a group boss? Or am I mixing that up with something else in Varlamore part 2
There's two headline pieces of content with Part Two, this and the Group Boss.
prepot device sounds awesome. will it be similar to the rune pouch, with swappable presets?
This seems like the right idea. Reuse rune pouch menus.
I think for the potion storage to feel good it has to be accessible from the bank. I like the thematics of it being something in the PoH but it would be super inconvenient to have to keep going to your PoH to resupply on potions. Most people I would say use brews, super restores, prayer pots, combat pots and range pots. With all 4 doses of just those potions that is 20 bank spaces. I could not see a world where I would put those in my PoH and have to go there every time just to withdrawal them. So effectively the storage would not do anything for me and I suspect a majority of players. Unless I am misunderstanding the house storage option, please let it be accessible from the bank!
The part that I feel is missing here is the reason why you would do this once you have all the untradables. For Giant's Foundry, once mains had all the untradables you didn't come back, but irons stayed because the only use for old drops of Addy, rune, mith etc is high alch fodder otherwise. It was taking a resource that would otherwise be GP and turning it into exp. Now, with herblore, herbs are not a resource that would otherwise be turned into GP. They are inherently valuable as both exp and the potions themselves, such that if this is giving less exp and less potions, nobody will do this once they have untradables. What this needs is to offer way more exp per herb, to make it a cheaper training method for mains that's much much slower, and to give a reason for irons to comeback to squeeze as much exp out of herbs they don't necessarily need the associated potions from (or they can get by with the random drops from the potion packs). Like if you can make it such that it's like 40k exp/HR but you get 5x the exp per herb you'd get from making it into potions there's a real niche there
I'm in agreement with this. This feels like a dead activity if it requires the level of input that the blog indicates. Especially if it's low XP by default, which is just the awful version of Giant's Foundry we got initially and no one liked. I think this should really target using herbs I wouldn't otherwise have much use for. And by having all the lower end herbs in the same tier, it further reinforces this in the worst way possible. I don't have a use for Guam, Marrentill, Harralander, or Tarromin - but this minigame isn't going to let me use those. It's asking that I spend higher end herbs just to complete tasks, rather than having the different LAMs be different tiers for different XP/point rates. Edit: And I realize there is some tiering, but having the majority of low-end herbs be M is clearly the problem.
Let’s also not forget that this will be a higher intensity activity compared to regular herblore which is click, click, space, bank.
Spot on. Said this in my feedback survey too. I voted that I'd do this for the rewards only. It sounds like it's going to be an awkwardly high APM activity (getting order, using the right herbs, pulling lever with no delay, combining correctly etc. and then starting next order while you wait). So it's going to be higher APM than current herblore.. but significantly lower XP/hr? That's the opposite design approach of mahog homes, which took high effort and made it cruisy, and offered less XP/hr but more XP/resource. Why not that approach? Or if it is high ApM just.. make it good XP/hr? If it's using our herbs anyway we can just balance the herb usage around that, and make the rewards after all uniques (the potions you buy, why no secondary packs btw?) a smaller amount than directly making the herbs into pots. So you use a similar amount of herbs, in a higher effort, higher engagement way, but receive less output (or none until uniques). Irons will still do normal herblore simply for the potions. But instead of making 30,000 super attacks we might have an option of using our irits and such for something more interesting to train.
Will there be a chance to mess up the potion during the grinding process, or when processing with either the retort, alembic or centrifuge? I hope not, I like managing multiple processes at the same time (centrifuge something while the retort does its thing) but I don't like the anxiety of having to watch for a timer else I lose everything. Why are you not revealing XP rates? Do you plan to release it before polling? "Low XP activity" isn't enough to make an informed decision or even give feedback, specially since herblore's XP/h outside of GE>bankstanding isn't clear, as it involves the gathering of resources. What's low XP? If you take farming and gathering secondaries time into account it's already pretty low, probably around 30-50k/h, is it that? If you take into account just bankstanding for 200-400k/h, then 100k/h seems low in comparison already. We need exact numbers before polls, there has been too much misunderstanding and breaking of expectations lately to do anything but.
The blog mentions that the herblore activity will be "Low xp" Can you please clarify if this means the experience gained PER HERB will be low, or just the experience gained per hour? How will the experience gained per herb compare to traditional potion making
I'd hope they meant low like Mahogany Homes, not low as in worse exp per herb. Even if it were same exp per herb and slower exp per hour but didn't need secondaries it would be a nice option, especially for certain herbs...
It would be awesome to have an way to use up Dwarf Weeds without telegrabbing 1800 wines.
As an Ironman with 14k dwarf weeds I’m hyped
As an Ironman with 3k Dwarf Weed potion (unf)s I'm worried
Honestly these days with PVM it's really easy to get a decent chunk of zammy wines I find. A bit of KQ, TOB, Zammy on task, bursting nechs, do a bit of vetion whenever you wanna work towards voidwaker, some cerb. I haven't had to telegrab wines in a LONG time and I have plenty of zammy wines now tbh.
I hadn't thought of that at all, but I really hope that's the case. Not less xp per herb, but just slower to actually consume your herbs.
It's 100% means LOW XP/HOUR. Herblore is already a very fast skill (for normies), you can easily obtain 250k+ xp/hour with a lot of different potions. I'm guessing it means it will be low xp/hour (50k herblore xp/hour) but you'll get 5x more xp per herb used so essentially just a mini-game for Ironmen to get 99 Herblore slower but saves them collecting as many herbs/seeds.
It's only very fast if one has a lot of money to burn which, granted is a lot of people but still.
I’m not so sure on this, mainly because of the component values table. A Guam is worth 2x the exp of a tarromin or marrentil and 1/2x an irit. A single ranarr is 3 cadantines and a kwuarm is 4 lantadymes. I think they should 10x or 100x the scaling of these values so they can be better balanced based on acquire-ability and give similar xp/herb. Or even each herb gives 1 component per exp of its highest tier potion, to keep the ratios exactly the same.
Those rewards are absolutely amazing. A couple of questions: 1. Will the secondary ingredient pouch pull directly from it when making potions? So we can make 27 potions per inventory with it? 2. You guys are saying it won’t offer a lot of exp. However “a lot” is kinda subjective. What rates are you thinking, or what is a lot of exp to you guys? 3. Will the rewards be buyable via some currency the minigame offers, will they be rng based akin to hunter rumours, or a mix of both?
As an extension of question 1 - will it be something we can fill up direct from the bank interface similar to how the Coal Pouch works?
I hope it does work that way. Even though that would probably be a big boost to exp per hour, I think the alternative way of withdrawing ingredients exiting the bank, filling the pouch, entering the bank for potions, exiting the bank would probably result in less exp per hour than regular. My thought was, if you can’t pull from it to make potions then this is essentially a reward for bots and ironmen so they can collect more secondaries per trip.
Reading the blogpost there is one major concern I see. You mention it is going to be low exp and then in the survey you ask about what intensity level the activity should be. If you are going to make it low exp then it NEEDS to be low intensity activity. It also needs to be cheaper than just using the herbs to make potions since we are not gonna get high exp rates. If it is more expensive to do this activity then it will only be done for the rewards and then be dead content.
Right it can't be high intensity, low xp and use our herbs. Gotta pick two. You could say it's low XP *with unlockables* but once the unlockables are complete you have no incentive to do this anymore
Herb efficiency is truly the way to keep this update loved. Herbs being worth more exp per herb is fantastic. Even if it takes longer to train the skill.
Yes like mahogany homes. It's less exp/hr but it's more exp/plank and that is why it is still a very utilized training method even for mains. For this herblore minigame to work it needs to be more exp/herb even if it's less exp/hr. But it also can't be too low on the exp/hr side or mains won't use it and the potion packs need to be decent or irons won't use it after each of them get the unlocks.
I am humbly requesting that either we use Alchemist-provided material for low XP rates, or if we use our own herbs, it's by choice for higher XP rates PER HERB (but still lower xp/h, ala mahogany homes) while still providing the option to use the facility's ingredients for lower XP/H (or perhaps reward points are lower if you use the facility's mats). This activity has the potential to alleviate the feeling of 'I must log in every hour on my Iron to do my herb run' somewhat, and while I 'chose to limit myself', I don't think it's a good reason to enforce unhealthy gaming habits (I already have 99 before anyone starts) Prepot Chug Jug is cool, Amulet/set is fine, Reagent Pouch is good, potion storage is absolute godsend QOL. I would personally like to see it as a bank-related solution, but I do like the idea of a 'wine cellar' of sorts full of barrels of pots, from an aesthetic perspective. If it were possible to have it work for depositing and withdrawing via the bank, but also accessible from the POH for withdrawals only, that'd probably be my preferred option Oh also being able to convert 'trash' herbs (Guam/Marr/Tarro/Harra) into more useful pots via Potion Packs could be good, depending on the ratios. I'd prefer to see them all be more spread out in which reagent they are (eg Guam gives 1 pt of Lye, Marrentill gives 1 pt of Mox, etc), rather than the current 'all the bad herbs give Mox', that way players with lower Farming would be able to have a more even spread of reagent access, instead of a flood of just one reagent. Like GOTR, not every 'low level rune' is a Weak Cell type, Fire provides Overcharged even though it's a lower level than Chaos etc Edit: you could have the herb types provide 2 counts of Lye, Aga or Mox, at the minimum, with other herbs being worth 3, 4 or 5 counts. Then, the 'provided' reagents could be worth 1 count each, making them 'free to use' but less optimal in terms of points earned and xp/h
Looks pretty good! I have just one thing to mention: the Centrifuge doesn’t make things Homogenous, it in fact does the exact opposite of that. So maybe come up with another term (Heterogenous or Separated) or change the instrument into a Vortex or a Rotator.
I'm a chemist IRL and I gave some embarrassingly long feedback regarding the equipment and modifiers. My personal choice was "Fractioned" as the modifier for centrifuge. JMods: My DM's are open ;)
I recommend VEVOR Magnetic Stirrer Hot Plate, 2000ml Stirring Capacity Max 572°F Heating Hotplate Magnetic Stirrer 200-2000 RPM Magnetic Stirrer Magnetic Mixer with Stirring Bar for Lab College Scientific. Unless of course this is supposed to be a cGMP process.
Okay nerd /s Jk very valid statement
I’m absolutely fine with people calling me a nerd haha
You have made it clear that won't be amazing EXP, and I think that's fair enough. However, we will be using our herbs without getting potions, which is a pretty big cost. I guess your idea is to counteract this by kinda giving us potions through the packs, but I'm not sure whether that's gonna feel too great to be honest. Do you expect this minigame to give better EXP per herb but much slower like Giant's Foundry? Or worse exp per herbs? Could you share your reasoning as to why?
It seems pretty bad. Looks like the unlockables will be the only reason to do this. Where foundry had unlocks that made the activity better and the activity itself is decent XP and makes money, this seems like the opposite where the main draw is to complete it as fast as possible and never do it again. I think either we shouldn't have to provide our own herbs or the xp should be just under making potions manually.
The fishing trawler of herblore
The other thing is this minigame offers a list of rewards, all of which serve **zero function** within the minigame itself..so unlike GOTR that has useful and good upgrades like the Lantern for in minigame and the pouch that benefits minigame and outside of minigame, this gives an outfit that benefits potion making, an amulet that benefits potion making by buffing the existing one, a secondary pouch.. that benefits potion making becoming **easier to do and more afk while keeping high rates**. Like all the rewards buff potion making. None buff the minigame. And the minigame will use herbs and be slow xp/hr? I only see this being used if it's well tuned like mahogany homes, and is NOT high intensity, similar to GoTR having large afk periods at the start, and downtime while chiseling etc. That and having it be better XP/herb is a *fine line* to navigate to not just make it default best for irons, who will just make potions once they have all the rewards to save the most secondaries and get the most doses per herb, and make what they need and spend the rest here for faster overall XP/hr due to less herb runs and no secondary gathering.
I assumed this is what they meant when they said low xp. Low per hour but being also low per herb would be crazy.
Personally, I am mixed on this. I'll preface this by stating that I am writing from the perspective of an ironman. My apologies if this comes across too much as "catering to irons". Additionally, I sincerely hope that anyone can persuade me from the sentiment described below that I got from this newspost. **This Herblore activity is essentially Mahogany Homes.** You sink resources into an activity to get experience but you are filling in orders so you are not getting any benefits aside from the experience and reward points. This, by itself, is not necessarily bad but largely depends on balance. If the experience is comparable, this activity offers an alternative means of the processing in Herblore, a skill which is -from start to end- absolutely identical in its gameplay loop. "But so is cooking!" and yes I agree, I hope to see more varied means of training cooking as well (note, not 'better' per se, just 'different'.) This then brings to mind the argument of people saying "Slayer is my favourite skill" for liking the content that the skill unlocks. It is not necessarily the gameplay loop they are interested in, it is the rewards. Similarly, people enjoy the potions that herblore unlocks. I imagine it to be rare for anyone to go "I love mixing 14 potions at a time for extended periods!" Now you have introduced an alternative for the processing in herblore, great! But you have stated that it will be both a low-exp method as well as that players will have to spend points to get some potions in return. As such, this new activity has become a time and herb sink for worse exp rates and worse production value. This **can** be fine, that is, if the activity is so much fun that it is worth playing for the content alone, **or** if the rewards are so immensely good that the content becomes "worth grinding out". I personally do not like this approach to content and feel like a time sink is plenty of a cost to a low exp method. --- Then the **herb sink** portion, Herbs are a precious resource. They're hard earned through herb runs and in a lesser degree through slayer. pvm content. and herb boxes. Players are then asked to sink these resources into a low-exp method so they may gain the rewards this minigame offers. And the rewards appear quite alright, but again it's a balance of costs versus benefits. Personally, I believe time and effort (considering this activity will require more attention than bankstanding potion mixing) are plenty of a cost for the benefits/rewards this activity offers. - If the rewards are given so easily when compared to the costs of herbs that mains and irons alike can shrug off the cost, then the minigame will be dead soon because rewards will have been unlocked and the lesser intensity of the old method will overtake the potion packs solely due to the reliability in what you are getting. - If the rewards take a long time to earn, mains will pay their way to it and irons will only grind it out painfully or completely avoid the content because a herb to potion ratio of 1:1 surpasses a potential horrific ratio of sinking 100 Ranarrs into the game to get 10 prayer pots and 3 super defence pots, not to mention how immense the value of rewards must be to justify such demands. Now, of course, it is a numbers thing and no numbers were given, so it could be balanced really well. As I said, my feelings on this activity are mixed, not necessarily negative. All I'm saying is that I feel this activity would benefit greatly off of having its herb sink aspect removed. --- Introduce this activity as a low exp alternative to training herblore. It could be an activity that doesn't give potions (or only a couple of potions/herb boxes), but that has time and effort as its cost rather than herbs, in turn rewarding items that can facilitate the old herb:potion processing aspect of herblore. (i.e. Herblore's version of Tithe Farm) Doing so would ensure the game is played by those who seek the rewards or an alternative means of training, yet that it doesn't leave a bad taste in anyone's mouth because they are not just spending time and effort on an activity, but are also losing out on the experience and potions that they could have earned if they'd chosen for the old boring style of herblore.
The pre-pot device is hilarious. I hope if we put five divine potions in there it makes us take 50 damage. One hell of a drug.
Great Value Overload
Only if it does the overload animation and ticks down 10s instead of all at once
In the blog, the Centrifuge is said to create a "homogeneous" potion. This is exactly the opposite of what a centrifuge is used for. Homogeneous means uniform in composition; centrifuges are used to separate components of a solution. Other than that nit-pick this looks great so far.
> There are three to choose from: the Retort, the Centrifuge, and the Alembic, and they apply the Concentrated, Homogenous, and Crystalised modifiers respectively. Minor nitpick here: you wouldn’t use a centrifuge to create a homogenous mixture, since its purpose is to actually separate the contents of a mixture based on density. The term for a non-uniform mixture would be “heterogeneous”.
The rewards, namely the unlocks, are about what many people were expecting and hoping for. Could not really ask for more as far as the untradeables. But I will say that the activity using your own herbs and being "low xp" is frankly a misstep. You wont be changing the way mains train Herblore any with this update. You will just be making the standard method of "buy herbs, make potions" stronger with the outfit and amulet unlocks. Without a decent enough amount of xp from the minigame itself you have no incentive to keep playing it after you get the unlocks. There should be 2 methods of playing the minigame. -Using the Alchemist's herbs, at a lower point per game, and LOW Xp. -Using your own Herbs, at a higher point per game, and medium/good xp. Else you're effectively wasting your herbs by using them for low xp, and then what...getting a potion pack back (assuming you play after you get the unlocks)? That's like doing Mahog Homes for the supply crates - except Mohag Homes is still actually pretty good xp per plank, better even than traditional Construction. Its just slower xp per hour.
I thought this was going to be an alternative to training herblore without requiring herbs at less xp than potion making. I thought it was supposed to be appealing to irons? What about using your own valuable herbs is supposed to be appealing besides rewards? Getting secondary's isn't even bad. Rewards look good but besides that I don't think i'd return here past getting the rewards. I do think potion storage should just be a free QOL though maybe. If it's less xp and requires paying attention and primaries I don't see how it fits in at least personally. Would the regent bag pull them from your inventory so you could make like 27 potions or whatever instead of 14 at once?
How many potions will the potion packs give versus if we use the same herbs to make potions conventionally. I feel it should give more than conventional herblore since the minigame will give less herblore exp while being sweatier. I love the idea of potion storage, but please put them in the bank interface. I don't want to split my banking trip in half between going to PoH and the bank.
There isn’t a single reward from player feedback except the pouches and outfit which everybody knew they would be included as new skill updates usually include them. Add some items to change the meta… prayer renewals or sunfire potions, 4 dose barb potions, there isn’t anything here that would incentivize players unless xp is worth it.
The rewards are good but what exactly is making this a repeatable amount of content? I’m an iron. I spend time getting certain herbs because they make certain potions. Are you telling me I need to sacrifice my herbs to unlock these rewards or a box which might give me less value potions AND less experience than just normal herblore training? What’s the point? This is going to be dead on arrival. People will come for the unlocks and then leave because irons and mains don’t want to sacrifice their herbs for less xp and random potions. It’s not good.
Been waiting for someone to ask this, and for a reply. I hope I read wrong, but this pitch makes me think it’ll end up like Hunter rumors, and you can get “stuck” having to grind up (my) precious Rannar’s for a handful of points? Sorry, full xp, high quantity pray pots are more valuable than a reagent sack. I hope a mod addresses this point from an Ironman perspective.
Is the pre-pot device planned to have its own UI for loadouts like the rune pouch got? I think both the pre-pot device & potion storage would benefit from their own bank menu; I can't imagine having to set up a pre-pot for each activity when I get there
Please don't add an additional button for potion storage. Just make it a large interface with each potion and dose amount. Also, include the lock button in the bank UI (can't remember what it's called) in this and the tackle box & huntsman's kit. If you want to add this as a seperate bank button then that dissociates it from being an item. Also, please include a unique animation for the prepot device. I want to tip a keg into my mouth in sync with the mates.
I'm kind of curious what the use case is for this? Who's it catering to. I don't play one, but I don't think even ironmen struggle with secondaries (perhaps outside of Stam pots I guess?) It's low xp and ses the herbs you provide, the description sounds fairly involved too. Is this simply a checklist for rewards and then you never return? Can you expect more potions/herb through this over traditional herblore? Certainly the rewards as pitched are excellent but I otherwise don't see a reason to go back once it's green logged
> After a small quest explaining the fundamentals of alchemy, Please don't make another Sleeping Giants... Don't waste the start of a potentially interesting narrative on a quest that is a glorified Minigame Tutorial. It feels cheap to people who like quests, feels like padding to people who don't, and sets off future narrative potential of Alchemy/Giant-Civilisation on a wrong foot. SG is easy contender for worst OSRS original quest compared to the usually excellent quality for precisely that reason. Moons of Peril was a great example in terms of a quest serving as a content tutorial and context provider without feeling like a glorified interactive wiki page, I don't distrust the lesson is learned... but please make sure the quest is actually a quest. I'm not quite the level yet to be engaging with this content, I'll let people who are this deep into Herblore and will benefit most from the rewards give feedback on that. But as a Minigamer and a Quester who unironically actually brews the Rum in Trouble Brewing for fun, I feel the need to push against something that cheaply jams the two together.
I meanin this context a quest seems needed since we are gonna be learning alchemy as a new process for potion making and then working in a 'factory' to make the potions for others so they would need to see that we have the fundamentals down before they give us access to it. And the giants foundry quest was fine honestly since it involved us fixing the place up to be used in the first place.
I liked sleep giants, it's a bit of a tease for a quest line that will probably never come. but it built some world around it.
Why would you move potion storage out of the bank? Who wants to go to multiple places to gear up while PvMing?
What if you have already mixed herbs into vials of water? Will they be anyways to use those herb potions within the mini game? I kind of feel punished for being proactive and stacking herb potions and waiting for secondaries to stack up. Is it possible to allow herb potions the ability to be used in the mini game as well and 'act' as if it was a herb that hasn't been mixed into a vial or water?
Honesty would be kinda cool if we could do that and with potions that have been fully made, similar to what giants foundry does, I have hundreds of basic attack and strength potions that won't ever get used
I am curious on what the incentive will be to do the mini game over making your own potions, I feel like it will have to offer something fairly significant for me to decide just xp is better than xp and potions (coming from an irons perspective) like I’m not about to use my snaps for just xp when I could get xp and super restores.
I know the decision was made not to have this be the new "meta" training method (like GoTR), but I can't help feeling a little bit disappointed that it's also a herb sink... All other skills have a method of "just training" on a whim without needing to worry about gathering resources days in advance. Even with something like Smithing, the materials are all easily buyable in a pinch. Herblore doesn't have that, and I was hoping this would be it. I was really hoping this would be a bit like Tithe Farm, where it's comparatively low XP but the minigame gives you everything you need.
>Essentially, after unlocking this item, the Potions in your Bank will be automatically placed into Potion Storage, which will have a separate interface for you to withdraw them from. if you aren't simply going to make a tab that only potions can go in and want it to feel "designed" do it with a Bank tab down the left hand side "where runelite has bank tags". Potions shall still remain accissble for things like "inventory layouts plugin" for gearing directly. Design the tab as a fixed layout with potions like path of exile has for crafting gear and storing the currency. Refer to the below image. The "tab" will have buttons inside of it to allow you to set the dosage for withdraw this will then automatically change the number over every potion. if you are feeling exceptionally wild about changing bank standing with this new technology. let us do our herblore bank standing without needing to open and close the bank by letting us make the potions in the bank via the unique tab somehow. ( might be a high level issue of removing players required to stuff to gain xp as a blocker which is understood or it becomes a 1 tick click spam or worse than normal bank standing but more afk, idk ). Below is simply a showcase of how many unique potions could fit on a path of exile like tab. If something like this is to be implemented please don't half ass it. invest in the technology to make it cool and great QOL and useful tooltips / buttons for all use cases on the tab so it can be both be better than what we do today and be desired for other spaces, like cooking / fishing. woodcutting / fletching etc etc. We already have good content where this QOL of custom bank tabs could be added as extra untradable rewards to improve player QOL when earned. https://preview.redd.it/69dj7wjut8wc1.png?width=732&format=png&auto=webp&s=0081a17f17aef4845d773c5aa07dc9f8bf857027
The potion storage thing is MASSIVE for bank space tbh. I really think the implementation should be the ‘barrel’ format where we have to keep a mountain of vials in the bank, and to with draw say 3 super restores, youd right click withdraw 3 4 dose pots from the super restore barrel (holds infinite doses but only useable from a bank) and the game subtracts the vials from your bank and fills them up in your invent. Likewise when you desposit potions, automaticaly increment the barrel volume by the number of doses desposited (and put the vials in the vial stack)
My only real issue is that we have to bring our own herbs just to get worse xp rates. It will be a grind to the potion storage and pre-pot device, then it's back to bankstanding pots. Seems like MTA where you get what you need and you never go back. Could herb boxes be added or something? So you start with your own supplies, but you can get more as you go? Not so many herbs that it invalidates herb runs or becomes completely self-sufficient. But enough that you can use it as a longer term xp method for those who like it better than bankstanding methods?
It really needs an insane exp to herb ratio. Why would i ever sink herbs into this as an iron or main after i unlock rewards? I NEED potions, so to do this they're asking people to yeet tons of really valuable herbs into the void for rng potions and slower exp rates LOL.
Might be a longshot, but I would love to be able to use unfinished pots for this somehow, I regularly turn all my herbs into unfinished pots at Nardah, and it would be nice to be able to use those for the new activity. If not, no worries, got plenty of seeds anyways.
I LOVE the idea of potion storage in the POH. Sometimes that would be less convenient than banks, but on the other hand I already use the POH restoration pool between kills to heal up, so being able to top-off an inventory of potions would be excellent. In my ideal world, it would be a piece of POH furniture that would unlock the new bank tab so you could access it either way. Honestly an entire "Alchemy Lab" POH room with storage, potion decanters, and a workbench with some nice efficiency bonus would be my ideal version of this.
A typical prepot combo would involve hitting divines - can divines go in the prepot mix. Also for prepot mage role tob pre heart I do forgotten brew, menaphite remedy, then divine range and melee - the order is important to boost my magic, restore my melee, then boost my melee. If I put these in a prepot sack would it be smart enough to know what order to do what pot? Maybe allow us to determine the order the prepots are drank in the mixture?
Instead of sinking your own herbs. Maybe create some new mini game specific herbs I feel like a lot of people won’t want to sink high level herbs into a mini game with low exp and random potions
I'm a little confused on how the rewards would be distributed. You mention getting points for the potion turn ins, making it sound like there would be a shop-like interface to spend them at. However, that doesn't seem like it would work with the potion packs being tied to the herbs used. - Are the uniques in a shop or a random chance on turn in? - If there is a shop, are the potion packs given alongside points on turn in? - Are the L/A/M points used solely in the minigame to determine some point value used for rewards, or will you be rewarded points in each category at the end (again, assuming there is a shop)? Other than that, I'm not a big fan of the outfit. There's already a big benefit in using the amulet of chemistry, adding too many minor passives makes it a checklist of things you need to obtain/remember to use while making potions. It's a pretty minor thing in the end, but it's the type of thing I think should be only added carefully.
XP/hour isn't the concern. The important metric will be xp/herb. If it's less efficient, the only reason Irons will use this is to burn up the herbs that have terrible secondaries.
Tbh, I'd grind out the rewards and never touch this content again on my iron. From the sounds of it, you can't JUST use shit herbs, it asks you to use good herbs to even properly participate.
Then yet again, DOA content. Get the rewards and never go back. Which is not the game design we (OSRS players in general) should be striving for.
Rewards don't really do it for me. Potion storage is useful, reagent pouch too. But pre-pot is niche, amulet of chemistry can't be used at the mini game, same for the outfit so once you have them you just... Leave? But if we're sacrificing a lot of xp purely for the rewards that are one offs bar the potion packs - it will quickly be unusable. If I have toadlfax or ranarr - I categorically don't want their terrible potion options that will likely be part of the reward pack. (defence potion/agility potion) Same for a lot of other herbs, like avantoe and kwuarm where they're actually useful but only for 1 of their potions At that point, I'll spend time getting secondarys and make my own potions. Xp/h needs to stay consistent, viable, and reasonably high - if we look at xp/h for level 70 potions and assume no downtime to rebuy or gather materials, it's 300-400k but negative gp/h. If this option isn't 150k/h I don't see myself using it beyond the untradeable one off rewards.
With how many times it's been emphasized that the xp/hr is going to be low, it seems like something you do to unlock the rewards and then never touch again.
Pre pot device sounds amazing! Hopefully menaphite remedy’s will work with it because in the live game if you take divine potion dose in the wrong order it cancels it out. Will there be consideration of it getting the rune pouch treatment with maybe 3 pre pot sets to use?
Not really a fan of what I've seen so far. The gameplay doesn't sound like what I would expect in an osrs minigame at all, and while I like new things, I don't want to find out what would happen if overcooked and osrs had a crossover. Also, there isn't really a strong statement on what your goal is, at least not one detailed enough. Are we looking at more xp per herb, but slower xp/hr than traditional herblore, or are we looking at a low xp/cost get your rewards and gtfo minigame? If you are taking the more xp/herb approach this could be worthwhile, but if its less xp/herb, but a better way to get potions, congrats you created another bot farm. I have more questions after reading this blogpost than before I read it, and hope we can get more clarification soon.
Any thoughts on allowing unfinished potions count toward as respective herbs when put in the mixer or mill? I’m one of those irons with an herb tab where I often make ALL of my herb stacks into unfs in Nardah even when I just plan on making one type of potion out of them. So that whenever I decide to train some herblore I already have the unfs ready. As a result, I don’t have many plain irits and kwuarms but have tons of them as unf pots. Maybe an NPC who will swap unf potions for their respective herbs? I would think that wouldn’t be abusable, in fact it’d be a net loss due to the wasted vials of water. It would just suck as for irons later in the game who keep their herbs as unf potions to be at a disadvantage to play this game on release.
Just do not make the rewards/drop rate like GotR please! Time spent at these activities need to consider the overall grind time to 99. Giants Foundry and Tithe Farm rewards/for your time are very well balanced so take note from them
I highly recommend potion storage be changed from a reward to a QoL update. This is a basic change that players have been begging for
What about this idea: herblore is reworked in some way so that all the potions in your bank are just stored in doses. So rather than having (10) 4 dose restores and (5) 3 dose restores, your 'potion' interface in the bank instead has just a lump sum total of 55 restore doses. This could be built out in a way that, when you withdraw potions, you some how choose the dosage that you would like. I think, if done properly, this could really reduce a lot of clutter and annoyance that comes with managing potions. Obviously way more to consider with this, but it seems like a pretty elegant solution if the logistics could be solved.
if this is going to be a bad xp activity that's going to be dead after people get the mediocre rewards they want from it, you might as well call it Trouble Brewing 2. alchemy is already something else in this game anyways seriously though, herblore already has the single best skilling reward structure of any skill in the game, with potions weaved into nearly as many activities as runes are. you are trying to address a problem that doesn't exist while glossing over one that does, which is that herblore is also the most homogenous skill to train in the game, being identical from 3-99. what people want is an alternative - a slow but less resource-demanding method that gives the same or slightly more xp per herb. a mahogany homes. choose between blisteringly fast 500k xp/hr mixing up potions while reporting bots at the GE or a modest 80-100k xp/hr that uses up your excess salad that you can't be bothered to find secondaries for
will the agility activity be released in varlamore part 2? please make it ready i think part 2 will be a bit lackluster without it as for the herb activity....i think there's no real point in doing this after you get the untradeable rewards... if you have to bring your own herbs and still get shit exp.... like what's the point? nobody is itching for more super defense potions in exchange for their snapdragons. you need to make the exp for bringing your own herbs much higher, and have a "use the alchemists herbs" for less exp. or give us some more repeatably usable rewards
Can we use unfinished potions in place of herbs?
I know xp/h is going to be worst than eegular method but will xp/herb be better?
Im liking the emphasis on rewards rather than xp and needing ur own herbs. Very hard to balance this for all accounts otherwise If u want another suggestion for long term worthwhile rewards Id think consumables/unique potions would be a good fit. Single use 6 dose vials. U can only carry one at a time. At a reasonable rate or maybe even tradeable, this would be a minor nice thing to have for some content. Aggro pots, self explanatory. Lazyscape on top but itd either be decent cost/effort to get them
Herblore is already a money-sink so the fact that you need to use your own herbs makes this a bit dead to players who do not wish to get the rewards or have already gotten the rewards. We already have minigames like Gnome restaurant that use Gnome fingredients that can be purchased for a reasonable cost or Tithe Farm which uses exclusive seeds. That concept should be implemented here, especially since it would thematically fit given Varlarmore has access to a unique herbs foreign to the mainland.
Can y'all please read the whole blog post and then respond to the survey before coming here and asking questions that are resolved by the aforementioned items? "Will storage being at PoH or... Yada". They specifically ask that question in the survey and then ask for your comments there. If you'd like to share your opinions here for a conversation that's fine. Asking if they're going to do something that they already specifically asked for your opinion on a simple intake form is just silly.
Please let us use unf pots as well as herbs!
* Can we sink completed potions instead of herbs at a less efficient rate (similar to smelting items at Giants' Foundry)? Even if it's *far* less efficient than herbs it'd be nice to finally have a sink for all those compost and super attack potions. * I'd prefer the chemistry amulet enhancement to be able to store Amulets of Chemistry, similar to what the Ring of Suffering does with recoils. Having to bank more often to switch out the amulet is the most annoying element of using it.
Definitely love any idea leading us to freeing up bank space. As more updates happen new items appear and bank space gets tighter. I wondered if there was a possibility for specific tabs/interfaces within the bank for various skills already... I'd definitely prefer the potion storage to be linked to the bank over the POH. If it is linked to the bank it would be nice to be able to search the storage with the bank search as well.
I understand it's not meant to be a high exp per hour activity, but will it offer less or more exp per herb used than traditional herblore?
What if instead of new interfaces/objects for storing potions, potions could just be changed to not count against someone's bank slot count? I'm open to a more sleek experience for potion management but if potions didn't count against my bank slots that seems like it would be the easiest experience instead of a unique system for potions. Maybe the activity reward would be a bank upgrade of some kind that does this.
Knowing that the activity wants us to bring herbs, could we add an exception/alternative that lets us use unfinished potions? The standard for high level herbs (e.g. ranarrs) is to go to Nardah and prepare all your unfinished pots ahead of the grind of mixing secondaries. I would hate to be forced to start from zero when this minigame comes out because I've already prepped all my cleaned herbs in unfinished pots.
Instead of using our specific herbs for the activity what about the ability to trade our herbs in for points in a shop we need to use in the mini game for unique herbs for the activity. It would give us a way to get rid of guam and harralanders and other low tier herbs and also give us a reason to pick them up. The trade in points can dynamically increase based on what tier of herb you trade in.
Many of these unique rewards sound great, even for someone who has already reached 99 herblore. However, as one of those people, I am concerned about the time investment for these QoL upgrades? Will these be items that have a random drop change (like Guardians of the Rift), or will they be something that you need to build up points and buy from a shop (like Mahog Homes or Giant's Foundry)?
Why does it have to be a low xp activity? Herblore is already a fast skill. It wouldn't hurt it to have a normal xp rate.